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Hi, Trudie!
That's a tournament rule adapted for home play. It's not an official NMJL rule. For more information about the unofficial "pay for the party" rule, see FAQ 19-CR.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 30, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

2025 bulletin/newsletter/magazine Q&A #8

On Sunday, December 29, 2024 at 01:12:26 PM EST, jamesc wrote:
Subject: Question #8 in the January 2025 magazine
Question 8 has to do when 2 players call for the same tile and the player who is not next in line exposes tiles, either for mahjongg or exposure which was the same occurrence for both players.
The answer was that the player who exposed their tiles gets the called tile, even though they were not next in line.
What is your take on the answer in the booklet?

I just posted column #811 today to discuss the controversies around the 2025 bulletin, so I'm going to append this exchange to the Comments in column #811.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 29, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Purchased in Hong Kong in 1985

On Monday, December 23, 2024 at 01:29:37 PM EST, Bruce P wrote:
Season’s greetings
Hello Tom,
I have a set I purchased in Hong Kong in 1985 from the Wing Kee Majong & Ivory Factory. The tiles have never been used, the case corners are slightly banged up from storage. I am gifting it to my daughter who wants to take up the game. Could you give me your opinion on the quality of what she is getting and what it might be worth.
• It is new condition, never been played. No odor or dirt. No defects of any kind.
• Based on your FAQ I’m assuming these are bone/bamboo even though the maker also sold ivory. I could see no Haversian pores anywhere. I could see slight evidence of ring structure on the ends of several tiles which confuses me.
• Basic 136 tile set is complete.
• 4 jokers
• 120 sticks
• 4 dice
• 4 wind discs
• No racks
• I can see from other posts that the case is identical to others from this time in covering and has bone clasps
Thank you,
Jeff M

Hi, Jeff!
You asked 2 questions:
1. The quality of the set: the case's corners are "slightly banged up," which is what you yourself told me. From your photo, it looks like the suit of Dots is slightly discolored – I'll bet those wrapped blanks are whiter.
2. It's worth a bit more than the ones that I bought in L.A.'s Chinatown in the nineties, due to inflation. My set was marked at $59.99 and I've seen similar ones marked at $79.99 – twenty years later, the dollar isn't worth as much. Google surprised the heck out of me by saying that $70 in 1990 is now worth $169. But if the dots are discolored, knock it down to $150. Personally, I don't think it's worth $150.
3. You didn't say what mah-jongg variant your daughter is going to learn. If she wants to use the set to play American style, she also needs four racks that your set doesn't come with, and she'll have to get joker stickers to put on the blanks and the 4 Chinese "100 uses" tiles.
4. It's not cow shinbone – it's pulverized reconstituted fishbone, as described in FAQ 7c (the "What's It Made Of" FAQ).
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 23, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Would you be able to tell me anything at all about them?

On Monday, December 23, 2024 at 11:09:04 AM EST, Aya M wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Hi Mr Sloper,
I have these mahjong sets given to me by my Japanese father and I would like, if possible, would you be able to tell me anything at all about them?
The velvet purple case with the red velvet lined boxes has instructions in Japanese so i'm uncertain if this means it's Richii mahjong or just a set bought in Japan with Japanese instructions for Chinese mahiong. I’m afraid I have no knowledge of Chinese mahjong, Japanese mahjong or American Mahjongg and I’ve tried researching but just confuse myself.
If you could tell me anything at all about any of the three sets, like where they could be from or what they could be made of, it would be much appreciated.
Thank you so much,
Aya
Sent from my iPhone

Konnichiwa, Aya!
I think you've sent me photos of three sets: the velvet one and two faux leather sets, one marked N and one marked S for some unknown reason.
The two faux leather sets are definitely for riichi majan because they include red fives. The other is also a Japanese set but without red fives.

Of note is the somewhat rare 4-pointed "star" tile, which is a filler for the case - each tray holds 36 tiles, and if there are only 3 red fives, then an empty space would be the result.

Left: the "star" tile referred to herein

An email from a reader indicates that those two sets may have been manufactured by Nintendo, which makes them interesting – but unfortunately there is ancient discolored adhesive tape on the tiles. I recommend you remove the tape and at least try to remove the residue. Then, I recommend you arrange the tiles in the 4 trays of each set as shown in the "Mystery Tiles" FAQ. In a Japanese set, you would only have the 4 trays of tiles - you would not have the extra tiles shown in the image below.

Since Japanese sets usually come with only four flowers, you'd put the flowers and red fives and star in the last column to the right. My set shown below has four* red fives (as do most Japanese sets these days) so I turned one of them face down - that's where you would put your star tile.
*Corrected

Once the tiles are arranged properly, if you have any additional questions, please include photo showing all four trays of properly arranged tiles, but just one set at a time. Multiple sets in one email can get things very mixed up. Oh, by the way - the two discs marked "50" do not belong in the set.

P.S. I didn't see your other question, what they're made of. Plastic.

Where was this German set made?

On Monday, December 23, 2024 at 07:32:58 AM EST, Helge A wrote:
Subject: Mahjong Set with German Letters - Where is it really From
Hello Tom,
I found your amazing site FAQs when researching the origin of a Mahjong-Set I got by my grandmother and which according to her, goes back to a relative stationed in China for Germany in the 1920s. There are a couple of things that I found unusual and so far I was unable to find similar sets in Galleries online. Therefore I wanted to ask you if you would be able to help me find out where this set came from (most likely) and when it was created?
The set contains the following tiles (28x20x15mm, of which 10mm bakelite and 5mm bamboo):
- 36 dots
- 36 bams,
- 36 craks (with Latin numerals as well)
- 16 Winds (marked OSWN)
- 12 dragons (white dragons are blanks)
- 8 Flowers
- 4 Extra Blanks
In addition:
- 99 Rectangular Chips (20x13x1mm)
- Bone Sticks (36x 2 dots, 40x 4dots, 36x 8dots, 8x 16dots)
- 1 Wind indicator disk
- 4 dice, a bit unevenly carved
- German Rulebook (printed in Germany between 1915 and 19:30), but possibly added later as the name in the book points to another relative.
What surprised me:
- The lettering on the east wind tiles is O(=Osten in German), but the rest of the set and my grandmothers story suggest China as the origin (white dragons blank).
-The craks contain the more elaborate signs you mention on the website as likely after 1970 but the set is definitely older.
- The material seems like bakelite, but I am unable to tell whether Chinese or American.
- The set comes in a box with 5 drawers, but it has feet and a door with hinges to open towards the side, which I have seen on few pictures.
- The red chips are unusual in shape (not round)
Would you be able to help me shed some light on where this set comes from (China or Germany, or even more precisely where in China if that is possible)?
I have added relevant pictures of the key parts (Flowers, Dragons, "1" bams, winds, Box).
All the best and looking forward to hear from you (in your forum).
All the Best
Helge

囧 Hi, Helge! I'm afraid I won't be very helpful. I agree that the set was manufactured for the German market. I would say it's probably Bakelite, which reached its popularity peak in the 1930s. But I can't say that the set was made in China, and I am not an expert on manufacturers and their locales. It's possible it was made in Germany or the USA or England. The booklet was printed no earlier than 1920-1923; it uses Babcock's spelling with the hyphen and double G. The red rectangular chips are unusual, and the wind indicator looks modern (not 1920s, could be 1930s). That's all I can tell from the pictures.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 23, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I would be interested to know if you can tell me something about it.

On Saturday, December 21, 2024 at 06:49:22 AM EST, steven k wrote:
Subject: new mahjong set / number 4
Hi Tom,
Here are some pictures from a new set I bought in China (quickly cleaned), with very sharp/fine carving, really tight bone/bamboo adjustments and pretty good tiles perpendicularity. One serie from the "wind/joker suite" has a design I haven't seen before (with a frame and Chinese character insude). I would be interested to know if you can tell me something about it. Best regards, Steven

Hi, Steven! Yes, I can tell you something about it. The tiles have been artificially aged by soaking in mud. You're missing flower tiles, and although you have all your white dragons, there's only one badly discolored blank tile. Jokers and winds are not part of any suit. And there's nothing unusual about the framed "100 uses" jokers.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
Winter solstice, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Confusing "conflicting claim" rules, redux again

On Wednesday, December 18, 2024 at 10:17:53 PM EST, Kathryne W wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Claiming a discard?
Today 2 players needed a discard for mahjongg. The rule states that the player next in turn to discarder has preference EXCEPT.......
The player next in turn had 4 exposed tiles and the other person had 7 exposed tiles. The person with the 7 exposed tiles said that they won because they had more exposed tiles. Is that correct?
Is there a rule that overrides "the person to the right" and makes it the person with the most exposed tiles?
Thank you very much
Kathryne W

Hi, Kathryne!
That wording about exposed tiles is ambiguous. The unfortunate wording has caused this question to be asked by several people since the 2024 card came out. I've seen it asked and answered on Facebook, and I answered this question for Beth C on April 26, below, and again for Mary Ann M on June 27.
Rules 5 and 6 on the card do not involve prior exposures. Both rules are talking about actions that occur entirely during the conflicting-claims situation. Let me paint a picture for #6:

0. No exposures are atop anyone's racks.
1. Player A throws out a tile and says its name.
2. Player C realizes this is a tile she needs for mah-jongg.
3. Player C speaks: "Mah-jongg!"
4. Player C starts to expose tiles from her hand, moving them to the top of the rack. Or she takes the discard and puts it atop her rack. The point is, one or more tiles has moved to the top of a rack.
5. Player B looks up from her tiles and speaks: "Wait, I'm next in line, and that's MY mah-jongg!"
6. Player B is too late, because Player C has already exposed some tiles. Player C wins.

Same thing for #5. No prior exposures factor into the situation. The player who acts, putting tiles atop the rack, has priority over a player who speaks a claim after the action. The reason for the rule is so that a player who's paying attention, and acts, doesn't have the rug pulled out from under her when a daydreamer or indecisive player realizes after the move that the tile was one she needed too.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 2, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Goulash question, part 2

On Tuesday, December 17, 2024 at 01:02:17 PM EST, gport wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Thanks
Phone: [omitted]
Sent from my iPad

You're welcome, gport! May the tiles be with you.

Goulash question

On Monday, December 16, 2024 at 11:22:32 PM EST, gport wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
I have a question when playing a goulash game.
I’ve added pics to explain.
I can’t find an answer to the question.
Thanks
Phone: [omitted]
Sent from my iPad

囧 Hello, gport!
I'm sorry, but this detail is not covered in Australian/British/Western rulebooks. (I assume you play Western since you mentioned the Goulash.) I haven't seen anything in Thompson & Maloney's Illustrated book covering the exchange or redemption of wild tiles.

American (NMJL) rules go into a lot of detail about how jokers may be used, but there's very little detail in T&M's book. If you were playing American rules rather than Australian/British/Western rules, the rule would be "no, you can't call a discarded tile to use it to redeem a joker."
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 17, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

2 players call "pause" at the same time for mahj

On Sunday, December 15, 2024 at 02:59:05 PM EST, Carol Ann R wrote:
Subject: Mahjongg question
If 2 players call "'pause" at the same time and both are for mahjong, who gets the tile?

Hi, Carol Ann! When two people call a discard for mah-jongg, the one next in order of play gets the tile and the win. This is stated on the back of the card. Or see FAQ 19-H.3.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 15, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Is there a rule that you MUST declare another player’s hand dead?

On Thursday, December 12, 2024 at 08:28:35 PM EST, Vivian B wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Is there a rule that you MUST declare another player’s hand dead if you think it’s dead?
Vivian

No, there isn't, Vivian!
I've heard that some groups view it as aggressive to call one another dead, so they let the player continue picking and discarding anyway. Those groups are not "scofflaws," they just collectively eschew the strategic advantage one gets from removing an opponent.
Some argue that a player who keeps playing might throw "my" mahj tile... others argue that stopping a player from strategically playing defensively (intentionally withholding "my" tile) increases the likelihood of winning.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
12/12/2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

What variant is my set designed for, part 4

On Tuesday, December 10, 2024 at 08:54:55 PM EST, Pete wrote:
Subject: Re: Complete mah-jongg set with only 4 flowers and 4 jokers?
Hi Tom,
All clear, thank you for your time and insight!
In the meantime I thoroughly explored your amazing website and some others, just for the fun of it. I have a feeling that this set might actually be Japanese, i.e. it was manufactured in Japan instead of China, but other than the dimensions of the tiles (including the white-black ratio) nothing really backs this up. :) My grandparents visited both countries so it's possible. But this is just guesswork and not too relevant at that. What I personally like about the set is - just a layman's impressions - that it seemingly tries to mimic older designs: comes in a slide-top box, uses the simplified/older version of wan, has plain white tiles as dragons, was hand-carved (as far as I can tell). Yet at the same time it's clearly a product of the modern plastic-era. As if it had a bit of an identity crisis, not quite knowing where to belong. :)
Anyway, I meander... Thank you again for your comments and opinion, and of course for the treasure trove of information that is your website!
Regards
Peter

You're welcome, Peter. But it's definitely not Japanese. The One Bams (birds) would be peacocks with spread tail, symmetrical – there would not be any 100 uses tiles – the calligraphy is not Japanese style – Japanese makers don't produce sharp-cornered tiles - and Japanese makers make briefcase-style cases, not slide-top boxes.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 10, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

How old and where from?

On Tuesday, December 10, 2024 at 12:38:35 PM EST, Mark wrote:
Subject: How old and where from?
Hi tom,
I recently acquired this set from a thrift store and was wondering if you could help me with identifying it, as per your FAQ it seems to be made out of bone and bamboo that has been dove tailed together, it's 135 pieces (seems to be missing one white dragon or blank tile). thanks!
regards,
mark.

Hi, Mark!
It was made in China, but it's hard to say when. Could have been made anytime between the 1930s and 1960s. You didn't send a pic of the backs, but from what I can see (the edges of your South wind tiles), the tiles were buried in mud for a while, to make the set look older and more valuable (a common practice). Since it's missing at least one blank tile and the flowers, I have to assume that someone took those to clean up and add to their set, before giving this box to the thrift shop. In conclusion, I can tell you where from but not how old.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 10, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Scoring disagreement (Australian/Western/British rules), part 2

On Saturday, December 7, 2024 at 09:09:53 PM EST, Dianne R wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Hi Tom
Thanks for your reply to my question of 8th December. I have the book in question but perhaps have not looked at it closely enough so your wisdom has been very helpful and your reply very prompt!
Best wishes
Dianne R
Get Outlook for Android

I'm glad I could be helpful, Dianne!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 8, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

What variant is my set designed for, part 3

On Saturday, December 7, 2024 at 05:14:30 PM EST, Pete wrote:
Subject: Re: Complete mah-jongg set with only 4 flowers and 4 jokers?
Hi Tom,
Sorry for any confusion I may have caused, however I - respectfully - believe you mistook me for someone else you were having an exchange with. I never said or implied my set was bone-and-bamboo, quite the opposite! To quote my own words from my first mail: "This particular set, I believe, was brought back by my grandparents as a souvenir from either China or Japan, probably in the 60's or '70s." and "...the tiles are made of glued-together two-toned plastic, putting them in the vintage category at best".
The tiles are 100% NOT bone and bamboo, that much I can tell. Unless some very unusual examples of bakelite, I had to assume they are just plain plastic pieces from the '60s or '70s. Thus I also assumed that the set, while really nice, does not have considerable market value as a collectible, therefore I would have no reason to keep it on a shelf rather than actually playing/practicing with it. And I thought I'd ask your opinion before I do just that. I only own this one set but if it's too valuable for everyday wear-and-tear then I'd rather invest in a cheap modern set to learn the ropes.
The "museum-remark" was meant to be a harmless joke, sorry!
Anyway, you have already helped me a lot, thank you! I gather from your reply that this set is not in the price range of a modest modern piece and should therefore be spared from regular use.
Regards
Peter

囧 Sorry about that, Peter. I speed-read sometimes, and occasionally I do miss a salient part of a question.
Normally, slide-top boxes contain bone-and-bamboo tiles, and you didn't show me the backs, so I jumped to a conclusion. The fact that your set is glued-together two-tone plastic tiles in a slide-top box is unusual. Not unusual in a "wow, that's collectible!" sense, just unusual and question-raising. I would agree that the timeframe is possibly 1960s-1970s. The value is less than that of a modern American-style set, because American-style sets are bigger, heavier, contain more parts, are marked with Western indices, and are more in demand in North America. The absence of indices is the crucial part of the equation, in terms of playability. You and your players would have to understand the writing on the craks and winds in order to play with it. Other than that, there's no reason not to use it in play.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 8, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Do you think they were made in China? (part 3)

On Sunday, December 8, 2024 at 02:56:15 AM EST, Lisa J wrote:
Subject: Tile Questions
Tom,
Hello! I just bought another set of tiles. They are 2-tone, white & green and the set has all of the tiles needed to play Chinese MJ. No Jokers.
I have 2 questions:
Can you please help me date these tiles
What do you think they are made from (Lucite?)
Thanks, and I really appreciate you sharing your knowledge!
Lisa M J, PhD
Tucson, AZ

Hi, Lisa,
1. I have a set just like that but the backs are blue. I bought it in the early 1990s, and it was new then. So I would assume that those sets were made in the late 1980s or early 1990s.
2. I don't know what difference it makes what plastic brand any tiles are constituted from, unless one needs to find a glue that will effectively stick tiles together (like to glue together crafts or tchotchkes from them. Or to repair a broken one). I believe these tiles are high-density polyethylene, myself. I suppose they COULD be lucite (polymethyl methacrylate or PMMA), but I don't know why it would matter what specific plastic they are. So I have not taught myself to detect the difference. I don't mean to pooh-pooh your question, it's just that I have a lack of interest (and therefore, expertise) in the subject.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 8, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

The 2024 NMJL card, part 13 (cont'd)

On Friday, December 6, 2024 at 07:08:31 PM EST, Rosalie T wrote:
Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Thank you so much. Appreciate .
Cheers
Rosalie

You're welcome, Rosalie!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 6, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

What variant is my set designed for, part 2

On Friday, December 6, 2024 at 11:13:23 AM EST, Pete wrote:
Subject: Re: Complete mah-jongg set with only 4 flowers and 4 jokers?
Hi Tom,
That was super fast, thank you very much! I am relieved to hear that I was overthinking the significance of the number of optional tiles in a set. As you could probably tell, I am completely new to the mah-jongg scene and only started researching the game after this curio from the past resurfaced. Only one question remains, just to be on the safe side: is it okay to put this particular set to practical use (i.e. play with it, practice with it) or rather, to quote a famous archeologist, "that belongs in a museum" ? :) Based on what I've read so far, there isn't anything particularly interesting or outstanding about this set, except maybe its pristine condition and a very agreeable quality of carving/coloring. The tiles have a non-gaudy, almost waxy shine and are somewhat heavy for their miniscule size (appr. 25x18x12mm ; the whole set including its lightweight box weighs 1,5kg). They consist of a thicker white and thin black half that are glued together. Many sleuths and enthusiasts literally break these down to their molecules, but to my untrained eye and simple mind they are just: plastics. :) But I am no expert and thought I'd ask before riling up three more people and drastically reducing the shelf life of this vintage set. :) If however it has about the same value as a modern plastic set on the cheap end, I see no reason to not using it.
Again, thank you very much and have a wonderful day!
Peter

Hi, Peter,
Now you're giving me new information that raises questions, so it's hard to answer the questions you're asking or implying. 1. Your set is not a museum piece. 2. What's this about the tile backs being plastic? I thought they were bone and bamboo. 3. The set is not "about the same value as a modern plastic set on the cheap end." It has to be evaluated on its own. Have you checked out FAQ 7H?
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 6, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

The 2024 NMJL card, part 13

On Friday, December 6, 2024 at 08:45:48 AM EST, Rosalie T wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
The fourth hand of the 369 group says any two suits, Pungs 3 6 or 9 w matching dragons
Player put down a lung of threes in bamboos and matching green dragons and pung of sixes in cracks and matching red dragons. This was challenged in our group. However it does not say LIKE pungs.
???
Cheers
Rosalie T

Hi, Rosalie!
As I wrote in FAQ 16, the fact that the card shows the number pungs as being alike is the League's way of showing (if not saying outright) that the pungs are indeed supposed to be alike. Your group was right to challenge the erroneous mahj claim.

What variant is my set designed for?

On Thursday, December 5, 2024 at 05:24:29 PM EST, Pete wrote:
Subject: Complete mah-jongg set with only 4 flowers and 4 jokers?
Hi Tom,
I was hoping you might be able to advise me on the basic rules/technicalities (= i.e. "how to play") regarding a particular mah-jongg set where I am somewhat puzzled by its composition.
This particular set, I believe, was brought back by my grandparents as a souvenir from either China or Japan, probably in the 60's or '70s. (Quite likely as the tiles are made of glued-together two-toned plastic, putting them in the vintage category at best.) The lack of Western characters indicates this set was made for use in Asia. What puzzles me is the tileset itself: this set has 144 tiles including 4 jokers (the "100 uses" Chinese variant). It only has 4 flowers (four seasons). I vaguely remember having seen this setup while searching online, but it sure comes across as uncommon. Does this tileset represent some Chinese sub-variant? Can I take out the jokers and play with only 140 tiles or in this case, do I need to take out the 4 flowers as well and play with the core 136 tiles only? Or is this completely normal, plays like regular Chinese mah-jongg with the added wrinkle that instead of the commonly used 8 flowers it comes with only four, plus the four jokers (that obviously act like jokers and not a substitute for other tiles such as flowers) ?
Many thanks for any clarification you might provide; I have attached a couple of photos for your convenience. The set comes with an unadorned slide-top wooden box and four Chinese dice. I don't think it was ever put to use; in fact I might be the first to open the box in many decades.
Regards
Peter

Hi, Peter!
It's common for those sets (smaller tiles in slide-top boxes) to include differing numbers of flowers and 100 Uses tiles. My belief is that a lot of Chinese mah-jongg tables and houses just left the flowers out, because the whole "East is 1, South is 2, West is 3, etc." thing was deemed an unnecessary complication (especially when the tiles are only labeled "Spring, Summer, Autumn, Winter" or "Plum, Orchid, Bamboo, Mum"). It's easy enough to use just four flowers if the table likes using flowers. In other words, those are optional tiles. And same for the 100 Uses tiles - use'em or don't, it's your prerogative. But if you do use them, you need to figure out the rules for any situations that may arise out of their use.
The set can be used for Hong Kong rules, Classical rules but with or without 4 flowers, and Japanese but without red fives, not to name all possible playable variants. The flowers and jokers are there in case somebody might want to add them in somehow; they're there if you want'em, leave'em out if you don't.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 5, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Those confusing joker rules

On Thursday, December 5, 2024 at 03:03:20 PM EST, Sharon C wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: joker exchange
Hello
What is the rule for the following situation?
A player has exposed a kongs of 6 cracks
Another player needs a single 6 crack. Can they take their joker and exchange for one of the exposed 6 cracks because they are doing singles and pairs hand so cannot use jokers.
Thanks so much for your thoughts
Sharon C in Toronto
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Sharon!
No, there is no such thing as "reverse redemption." Joker redemption works one way only. It's a one-way street. The player who needs the single 6C has to either find another hand or play defensively.
P.S. I'd like to apologize on behalf of the nation (or half of it, anyway) for the boorish behavior of darn old tRump to Mr. Trudeau and the people of Canada.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 5, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Those confusing joker rules

On Thursday, December 5, 2024 at 04:34:14 PM EST, Genie S wrote:
Subject: Trading jokers
Hello,
If a player has exposed a kong with 2 flowers and 2 jokers, can the next player exchange both jokers with flowers in the same turn after they have drawn a tile?
Genie

Hi, Genie!
Yes, a player may exchange/redeem up to 8 jokers on one turn.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 5, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Scoring disagreement (Australian/Western/British rules)

On Sunday, December 1, 2024 at 10:54:11 PM EST, Dianne R wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Hi Tom
I live in New Zealand and I am currently playing in one Mahjong group. My friend and fellow starter of our new group in our retirement village plays in two other groups but we both play by very similar rules in the groups that we play in outside of the village. We use the Mahjong Players Companion by Patricia A. Thompson & Betty Maloney. We have been teaching several new players who are keen to learn Mahjong. We have insisted that all new members that want to learn have to use the above book. However, there are different interpretations of some of the rules and I think we need to make some rules that everyone can adhere to in this group. The two groups that me and my friend currently play in don't score so we will continue with that meantime. Both my friend and I in our other groups understand that the Red Dot hands are the points for scoring but we have both been taught that the red dots on the various hands also mean that you can only pung those hands, not all the hands in the book. We ae now finding that new players do not agree that this is correct and we should be able to pung any appropriate hand in the book. Are you able to clarify for me so that we can put this argument to rest. Your interpretation would give us a clear understanding and as it is early days for this group, now is the time to have a clear indication of what hands can be punged in the book we use.
Kind Regards and thanks in advance.
Dianne, Auckland NZ

Hi, Dianne!
Of course you always consult page 4 whenever you have to discuss what the red dots mean in the Companion? But maybe the concept of "exposed" and "concealed" is not discussed as fully in T&M's Companion as it is in their main book, The Game of Mah Jong Illustrated. In my opinion, the real definitive work by T&M is their Illustrated book. The Companion is meant to be only just that, a "companion" or supplemental book. If you only use their Companion without also having Illustrated on hand, you're playing without full details on the rules of Australian (or "Western") mah-jongg.

When making a Concealed hand, one is not allowed to call a discard and make an exposure of a pung, kong, or chow. This isn't an arbitrary rule Thompson & Maloney made up to discourage or confuse new players. Concealed hands are supposed to be harder to make, otherwise the game is too easy, and other players who are working on high-scoring hands rarely get a chance to score big.
Another way Australian rules prevent too-easy wins is by limiting the number of chows an ordinary hand may contain to one.
I hope I've been helpful? I really recommend that your group rely on more than T&M's Companion book, to also include The Game of Mah Jong Illustrated, so as to arrive at consensus on the rules of Australian/Western/British mah-jongg.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
December 2, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Do you think they were made in China? (part 2)

On Monday, November 25, 2024 at 03:34:41 AM EST, Lisa J wrote:
Re: Question for you
Hi! I have another set, if you could take a look. I think these are also made in China, not sure about how long ago. All of the tiles are in the set. I appreciate your knowledge in this area.
Lisa
image0.jpeg
Sent from my iPhone

Yes, the set was made in China. About 100+/- years ago.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 25, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

What is the oldest NMJL card, part 2

On Sunday, November 24, 2024 at 01:37:39 PM EST, Theo P wrote:
Subject: Re: Old NMJL cards
Tom,
Thank you for publishing the question and your response! I also only had cards going back to 1941, which is why I jumped on the opportunity to buy this set of 4 1940 cards in very good condition. Please feel free to add this to the post, as others may be interested to know there was a card published in 1940.
-Theo

Cool, Theo. That might be the first NMJL card in card form. If you're a Facebook user, you might want to post in some of the mah-jongg groups, where you may get in touch with other collectors, who can share their experience with early cards. Good luck!
May the cards be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
11/24/24
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

What is the oldest NMJL card?

On Saturday, November 23, 2024 at 10:36:54 PM EST, Theo P wrote:
Subject: Old NMJL cards
Hi, Tom!
I am collecting vintage NMJL cards. I have all but a dozen years now. The question I have is what is the oldest card? I have seen a set of cards from 1940 that look different than the cards from 1941 on through today’s modern cards. I know the NMLJ was founded in 1937. Do you know if they published cards in 1937 1938 or 1939?
Thank you,
Theo P

Hi, Theo!
As far as I know, for the first few years of the League's existence, the hands were not written in "card" format, but instead were listed in Viola Cecil's "Maajh; The American Version of an Ancient Chinese Game," pictured here.

In all forms of mah-jongg except American, special hands were and are listed in a book, not on a card. American is the exception. My earliest card is the 1941-42 card.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 23, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Are you able to date or locate, part 4

On Tuesday, November 19, 2024 at 05:17:29 PM EST, steven k wrote:
Subject: Set number 3

Steven, I think these tiles are small (not as large as 30x20x12mm). The "stick" bams together with the small size suggest these tiles were made in the 1930s, give or take. The box looks suspiciously newer, though. If the set is original to the box, it could have been made in the 1960s. It's again notable that the 1-bam "bird" tiles have worn down because the carving is shallower than the carving on the other tiles. I think it's likely that all three sets of tiles are the same age, anywhere from the 1930s to the 1960s. In China, bad luck at mah-jongg renders a set of tiles as "cursed," which is why it's hard to find old sets in China.
All in all, I would say there's nothing remarkable or interesting about these three sets. If the two wood-backed sets' tiles are of similar size and color, you could "Frankenstein" one complete set from them. But it looks like the colors of the backs are too different.
By the way, those blank tiles are the white dragons. They fill the gap between the Norths and green dragons.
This was interesting, Steven. And well done on the photographs.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 19, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Are you able to date or locate, part 3

On Tuesday, November 19, 2024 at 05:15:51 PM EST, steven k wrote:
Subject: Set number 2
Téléchargez Outlook pour iOS

Hi, Steven. There are tiles in the box that are not in the first picture. I have to assume you intentionally left those out because they don't match. I see a couple of "stick" bams in the box. Those and the two yellow tiles and the hand-drawn 4-dot tile were surely intended as replacement tiles by a previous owner.
This set looks like the tiles are smaller than 30x20x12mm, making me think this set is from the 1930s or later. You previously said these tiles' backs are darkened bamboo, but I don't think so. I think they're made from a dark wood. The box could be original to the set. Since mah-jongg was frowned upon as a gambling game, the box's plainness is intentional.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 19, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Are you able to date or locate, part 2

On Tuesday, November 19, 2024 at 05:14:05 PM EST, steven k wrote:
Subject: Set number 1
Hi Tom,
I took some times to take the different pictures and tried to follow your display but couldn’t reach it perfectly.
The second and third set haven’t been cleaned yet, at least on 5 sides. For the box it is exactly what I have collected when I bought them.
Below are set number 1 pictures.
BR,
Steven
Téléchargez Outlook pour iOS

Hi, Steven. Too bad so many tiles are missing. As I said yesterday, I can't tell you which part of China it came from. Telling its age is a bit tricky, because mainly of those 1-bam (bird) tiles. The designs of the bird don't seem to be carved, certainly not as deeply as all the other tiles. That makes me think those tiles were marked later, by an owner of the set, to look like a bird. Possibly four of the blank tiles (white dragons) were used to make those bird tiles.
Based on the "leaf" bams as opposed to the "stick" bams, it would seem this set may have originally made for domestic sale approximately 100 years ago, give or take. This set was definitely not made any earlier than the 1910s, although it would be necessary to see what the original 1-bam (bird) tiles looked like before somebody decided to make new bird tiles.
Also, "leaf" bams are not a sure indicator of earlier manufacture, especially given the usual style of the Fa and Chung tiles (dragons). I'm guessing that these tiles are fairly small? Not the typical size? Typical bone tiles of the 1920s measured about 30mm x 20mm x 12mm. Are these tiles more like 26mm x 20mm x 12mm, or even smaller? If so, they are probably of later manufacture (late 1920s or 1930s, maybe even later).
You said that the backs are made of ox horn. I'll have to take your word for that. The Playboy box doesn't help us age the set, of course.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 19, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Are you able to date or locate

On Monday, November 18, 2024 at 06:33:51 PM EST, steven k wrote:
Subject: Fw: old time mahjong investigation
with pictures in the core email
From: steven k
Sent: Monday, November 18, 2024 11:13 PM
To: MJ@Sloperama
Subject: old time mahjong investigation
Hi Tom,
I am a mahjong lover, playing with my family in law, located in China, and I'm really fascinated by the beauty of this game.
As I am also passionnated with antiques, I've been searching for old mahjong sets since years (I've been leaving in China during 10 years, since 2001).
I found some interesting sets (never paid attention to the one dedicated to export), not properly complete for most of them, but for which I'd be curious to know if you'be be able to date or locate them.
2 of them are made of bone and bamboo (quite dark/reddish) and the last one is made of ox horn instead of bamboo (never managed to find another set like this one).
They are all quite worn out, with extremely smooth round corners and with simple/basic carving.
I can provide more detailed pictures if needed.
Thanks for your help,
Steven

I should also see pictures of the container the tiles are in – what it looks like empty and what it looks like, open, with the tiles in it. And one showing the container closed. And a separate photo showing what the backs and sides of the tiles look like.
Since there are three sets, you should send me pictures of each set separately. Mixing pictures of multiple sets would overly complicate the examination.
I can make guesses about which decade a set was made in, but I don't know enough about regional carving differences.
By the way, your peacock tiles are upside down in the set with the 2-dot at upper left corner (the one on the left).
Standing by for those pictures...
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 18, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Multi-table seat rotation

On Monday, November 18, 2024 at 09:46:40 AM EST, Joyce C wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
If we have two tables of four and exchange East each time from both
tables, we don't get to play with everyone. We always change tables
with the same person. How can we do it so we get to play with
everyone? Thanks.
Joyce C

囧 Hi, Joyce! Sorry, but your question goes beyond my expertise. The official rules don't discuss how to equitably rotate seats with multiple tables. However, I have frequently gotten readers writing in with their table rotation solutions, so I suggest that you check out FAQ 27 and see if you can get any helpful ideas from there. Good luck!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 18, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

The proper way of displaying a concealed kong

On Sunday, November 17, 2024 at 07:11:18 PM EST, joni.m wrote:
Subject: Minor questions about melding a kong
Hi Tom—our mahjong group here in Pullman, WA, is putting together a handbook for us and newbies that are joining us to play. We play Classic Chinese style and have learned the most about the game from Millington’s The Complete Book of Mah-Jongg: The Rules, Strategy, and Philosophy of the Classical Chinese Game.
My question is simple: When a player is dealt four of a kind, and she melds it as a concealed kong, does she place all of the tiles face down? Or does she place two of the outer tiles face down and the two in the middle face up?
Millington’s book says that concealed kongs are melded with two outside tiles face down, two inner tiles face up. I have seen it represented by others who say that initially dealt kongs are melded all face down while kongs subsequently constructed by drawing from the wall are shown by the two-tiles-outside-face-down and two-tiles-inner-face-up.
I hope my question makes sense. I look forward to hearing from you!
Joni M
P.S. Personally, I like melding initially dealt kongs face down and subsequently constructed kongs with the outer tiles facing up and the inner tiles facing down. In this case, I’d be able to make the distinction between kongs created with initially dealt tiles or those that were constructed with tiles subsequently drawn from the wall.

Hi, Joni! The reason for more than one way of displaying kongs is to clearly indicate how those kongs are to be scored. There are only two ways to score a kong: concealed and made by discard. There is no scoring difference between a concealed kong that came into the hand in the initial deal versus a concealed kong that came about by picking from the wall. So there doesn't need to be a different way of displaying a concealed kong made by one way or the other, since they are scored the same. I've checked several authors (including Millington) to be sure, and I find that they all agree that a concealed kong shows the two middle tiles face-up, whereas an exposed kong shows all tiles face-up.

In my brief check, I didn't find any examples of all-face-down displays of a concealed kong. That doesn't mean there isn't an author out there somewhere (or in my bookshelf) who espouses face-down kongs. But, assuming that whenever anyone melds a concealed kong, they show the faces of all four tiles before turning any of them face-down, you could turn them all face-down, but that could result in a player forgetting what those tiles are and making a mistake waiting for one of those. So it could be seen as either "unfriendly" to turn them all face-down, or a test of how good all players' memory is. In my opinion, it's best to go with what Millington says: two face-up or four face-up (and not four face-down).
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 18, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

How old and how much, part 2

On Friday, November 15, 2024 at 09:50:16 AM EST, Kevin W wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Thank you so much Tom! Wishing you well from Stratford-upon-Avon!
Kind regards
Kevin
Sent from my iPhone

You're welcome, Kevin.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom

How old and how much?

On Friday, November 15, 2024 at 08:18:38 AM EST, Kevin W wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
I have an old Mahjongg set how can you guess it’s age please from the set and the box? Is it of any value too. The handwritten notes are fascinating - there are 144 pieces plus 4 blanks.
1 instruction says Made in China
1 instruction says Jaques & the doubling & score cards say Chad valley!
Apologies I haven’t seen one like it & need to start researching, nor have I ever played - I am at a loss where to start and your website seems to be most helpful.
Kind regards
Kevin W
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Kevin,
Age: most likely 90-100 years.
Value: probably US$90-190. I doubt anyone would want to pay US$200 for it, but the handwritten(?) sheet is intriguing, although it may not be mah-jongg-related. The paper materials do factor into this valuation. The awl or clay tool (?) is not mah-jongg-related and should be removed from the set.
Cheers. May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 15, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

No Subject

On Thursday, November 14, 2024 at 10:46:32 AM EST, John Doe <john.doe@clonemailsieure.com> wrote:
Subject: (No Subject)

Reply: (No Reply)*
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 14, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

* It happened once before.

Scoring flowers in Chinese mah-jongg

On Wednesday, November 13, 2024 at 01:30:07 PM EST, linm wrote:
Subject: Mah Jong scoring
Hi Tom, my sister Dawn B referred you to me. I have a group of 12 ladies that play Chinese Mah Jong once a week. Everyone loves playing! We occasionally have a scoring question that comes up. I'm hoping you have the answers.
1. On the score sheet you have under flowers and seasons grounded and in hand. When are they considered in hand?
2. When you have all one suit , no winds, dragons or flowers. Scoring shows 3 doubles, why include flowers when no part of hand.
3. It shows on scoring under pairs 4 Points for each flower or season, but it also shows at top of scoring for 3 flowers grounded 12 points and in hand 24. So if we scored 4 for each totaling 12 under the section pairs, do we again get to score from the scoring up above for three flowers or seasons is 12 grounded and in hand 24 or is that double dipping? Also when are they in hand, which you may have answered in question number 1.
Thanks so much for your help.
Linda B
Sent from Samsung Galaxy smartphone.

Hi, Linda! There are several Chinese variants, and I don't know which one you're playing. You say there's a scoresheet, and you seem to be saying I had something to do with that scoresheet? I suppose it's possible it could have come from my "downlode" folder, where I've made reader-submitted documents available for download. But I think I can help with your questions:
1. I call flowers and seasons just "flowers." The difference might be simply that four of them have red numbers and four of them have green numbers (some variants award points for having all four red ones or all four green ones, usually called a "bouquet"). In the context of your questions, it's clear to me that "grounded" flowers have been exposed or laid down flat, face-up on the table for scoring purposes (and are no longer concealed within the standing tiles of the hand). In the Chinese variants I'm familiar with, it would be unusual to keep a flower concealed within the hand. The only reason I can think of to keep a flower in the hand is because Singapore-style flower-capturing is part of the play. Or because non-winners can score points for concealed flowers.
2. I assume this 3-doubles score requires that no flowers be laid down face-up at the winner's side of the table, because it's a little difficult to not get any flowers (because there are 8 of them in the set). (Note also that I'm assuming you're talking about a winner scoring the hand, not a non-winner.)
3. You can't double-dip scoring the flowers. Either they're exposed (grounded) or concealed (in hand) and they're scored one time according to that difference.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 13, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Is there a rule that says how loudly a player must name discards?

On Tuesday, November 12, 2024 at 09:35:06 AM EST, Sally C wrote:
Subject: Mah Jongg Question
One of the people in our MahJongg group always talks softly when placing her discard on the table. She is not a soft spoken
person in general, only when she discards a tile. I have tried telling her that she must speak up when discarding but she
continues to do this. Perhaps it is part of her strategy. I know MahJongg is a looking and listening game, but if you can't hear
her it makes it difficult to look down at your hand as I must always be looking at what she discards. Is there any kind of a rule
that says she must enunciate her tiles so we all can hear?
Sally C

Hi, Sally! The rule on page 14* only says, "[The] tile is discarded face up, calling it by name." It doesn't say "whisper," it says "call," and in my opinion that reasonably implies saying the name in such a manner that it is audible to others at the table. I agree that it could be a "strategy" of sorts, and I have encountered players who deliberately say the tile's name quietly in hopes that doing so will result in it not being claimed by someone else.
To reiterate: In my opinion, "calling it by name" does imply that the tile's name should indeed be audible.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 12, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

* That's a reference to the League's official rulebook, Mah Jongg Made Easy.

Hi, Andrea. They do if that is your group's table rule. But if your group plays strictly by the NMJL official rules, then no. In a tournament, there is a penalty for throwing to three exposures, but that is not part of the official rules. To learn more about the misunderstood "pay for the party" rules, see FAQ 19-Y.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 11, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Any chance for a revision?

On Saturday, November 9, 2024 at 12:41:26 PM EST, Elizabeth U wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Tom, any plans to update and reissue your book, ‘The Red Dragon and the West Wind’?
I see a continual and growing interest- in both, the American Mahjong version and in the MCR version- where I live.
I hope to teach the MCR game soon and will suggest your book and website. My book is pretty tattered with errata points noted and corrections made.
Would a few thousand ‘yes please’ votes from readers help you undertake an update?
Thank you for your column and shared mahjong lore.
Elizabeth U, Farmington, Michigan

Let's put it this way, Elizabeth. A petition could help me make the case to the publisher, who still has not recouped on the royalty and is thus likely and understandably reluctant to put more work into it.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 9, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Can I ask you a question?

Haruko Sakuragi
You're not friends on Facebook
1 mutual friend: N...
Lives in Los Angeles, California
10:26?AM
Bring you my most sincere greetings
??I'm sorry to bother you, I saw your profile, can I ask you a question?
If you reply, Haruko Sakuragi will also be able to call you and see info like your Active Status and when you've read messages.
Block Delete

囧 Well, if it's a mah-jongg question,* sure, go ahead. But please use email rather than Meta (Facebook) Messenger.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 5, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

*But if you just want access to my Meta (Facebook) friends list, or my phone number, well, I'm not going to reply to the message merely based on your having friended someone I worked with back in the eighties.

I need to exchange a joker so I can call, part 2

On Monday, November 4, 2024 at 09:00:24 PM EST, Connie V wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Thanks for the info Tom. I appreciate it!
Connie VP

You're welcome, Connie!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 4, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

How to age this ivory and bamboo set?

On Sunday, November 3, 2024 at 10:12:27 AM EST, Cynthia G wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Can you tell me where I can find out the age of this Ivory and bamboo set? Is there somewhere I can trade a tile for one I’m missing since you can’t sell ivory? I went through your description on your site. Yes they are translucent on the edges, yes they are individually carved. They however were not stored in velvet case. Stored in a wooden case. Inherited from a 99 year old woman 20 years ago from Green Bay Wisconsin. 
Thank you,
Cynthia 

囧 Hi, Cynthia! Sorry I didn't reply sooner. I just now found your email in my spam folder.
I might be able to tell you how old your set is (and whether or not it's made of ivory) if I could see it. Care to send me some pictures? Make them clear and large. Too many people send me tiny 320x240 pixel pictures, can you imagine? Pictures should be "large" or at least one megapixel in order to be useful.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
Monday, November 4, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I need to exchange a joker so I can call a discard.

On Saturday, November 2, 2024 at 01:03:17 AM EDT, Connie V wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
I want to pick up a discard but also need to exchange a tile for a joker to use with the discard. My understanding is my turn starts when I pick up a tile, whether from the Wall or a discard. Does this matter in this situation?
Thanks, Connie

囧 Hi, Connie! Sorry I didn't reply sooner. I just now found your email in my spam folder.
The answer is no, you can't first redeem a joker before you can call a discard. You have to call the discard, make the COMPLETE exposure (without using that redeemed joker in the exposure). For more detailed information on this rule, see FAQ 19M.2..
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
Monday, November 4, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I can’t understand why they would want to but is it legal?

On Friday, November 1, 2024 at 09:25:19 AM EDT, Barbara W wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
This was asked on Modern Mahjong. I can’t understand why they would want to but is it legal? My mah-jongg question or comment is:
I have a question based on my understanding that you can only call another player dead based on exposures and discards that are visible to all, not anything in your own hand (on the sloped part of the rack). Is it allowed to expose without calling a discard so that I can prove another player is dead? I might want to risk other players intuitung my hand for the advantage of increasing my odds of drawing needed tiles.

No, it's not allowed to expose without calling a discard (except for mah-jongg by self-pick).
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
November 1, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Clockwise, counterclockwise? Let me see if I have this right...

On Thursday, October 31, 2024 at 05:30:46 PM EDT, Karen E wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Which direction, right or left of East, do the sets of four tiles get distributed?
I am aware that each player can take her own sets of 4 × 3 + 1( and East +2) I know the walls come out to the left of East, but I thought the dealing is to the right, that's counterclockwise. At least that's how I've been playing for the past 6 years!
Thank you,
Karen

Hi, Karen!
After East takes her own tiles, the player to her right (counterclockwise) takes her four tiles. Those tiles come from the left (clockwise) of the gap where East took her tiles. The players take turns going to the right (counterclockwise). The tiles come off the wall to the left (clockwise).

Does that match how you've been doing it? If this diagram doesn't do it for you, I have more diagrams on what I call "the deal" (the term "dealer" is a misnomer, the diagram should say "East" instead), at FAQ 19Q.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
Halloween, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Oopsie! Do-over?

On Thursday, October 31, 2024 at 11:17:17 AM EDT, barbara w wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: if a player declares mah jongg and is paid but then realizes they were jokerless, do they get paid double?

No, Barbara. Once the winner has requested and received payment, there are no do-overs. She gets no more than she asked for and was already paid. For more details on the rule, see FAQ 19-W.5.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 31, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Are all the jokers in the exposed dead hand now free to be exchanged, part 2

On Tuesday, October 29, 2024 at 06:43:24 PM EDT, Carmen S wrote:
Re: Follow up info on jokers in a MJ error
Thank you so much. I appreciates your timely response. We’d never encountered that particular situation before and have been playing every Monday for three years!!
Carmen

You're welcome, Carmen!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper

Are all the jokers in the exposed dead hand now free to be exchanged?

On Tuesday, October 29, 2024 at 03:18:25 PM EDT, Carmen S wrote:
Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Please clarify…
We had a player declare an exposed MJ hand, then another player noticed that a unit exposed was to be all 8 cracks BUT one tile was actually a 6 crack. Dead hand…?
Does the person who declared MJ leave her tiles exposed now… and are all the Jokers in the exposed hand now free to be exchanged by the remaining players…
( unless a Joker was with the “8 crack grouping” ???)
Thank You
Carmen S

On Tuesday, October 29, 2024 at 04:46:31 PM EDT, Carmen S wrote:
Follow up info on jokers in a MJ error
Just told that when the MJ was declared , the whole hand was not exposed before another player noticed the grouping error of cracks.
Some jokers in groupings had not yet been displayed in the declared MJ error.
Are the Jokers in the hand not yet displayed stay concealed or are they to be displayed at this point???
Thank you…
Carmen S

Hi, Carmen!
The rule is stated in FAQ 19P, "Can I redeem a joker from a dead player's rack?" When a dead player has jokers exposed on her rack, some of her jokers might be redeemable, and some might not, depending on whether the joker was exposed properly or not. In the case you cited, some groupings (but not all) were exposed along with the mah-jongg declaration. You didn't mention whether any groupings had already been exposed prior to the mah-jongg declaration (if there were, those groupings remain atop the rack). All groupings exposed contemporaneously with the mahj declaration, however, were in error because of the "8 craks" exposure that was actually 6 craks. As stated in FAQ 19P, all portions of the hand exposed erroneously are to be returned to the sloping front of the rack, including and especially the jokers. The official rule is stated in MJME 2023, page 22, rule 4 (b). That's "Mah Jongg Made Easy," the League's official rulebook. Every table should have a copy.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 29, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Mah-jongg tiles for the blind

On Sunday, October 27, 2024 at 12:42:27 AM EDT, Donna A wrote:
Mah-Jongg Q A
My mah-jongg question or comment:
Good Evening Sir,
To your knowledge has there ever been an adaptation of American Mah Jongg for the blind? And if so, where would I find such an adapted set?
Sincerely,
Donna A

Hi, Donna! I discussed braille tiles in FAQ 7S but at the time I wrote that, there were no braille tiles to be found (other than in a museum). Just now, since you asked, I Googled "braille mah jongg" and found https://64ouncebraille.com/products/braille-mahjong-tile-set and other links too.
I'm updating FAQ 7S accordingly.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 27, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Scrubbing Bubbles

Ruth S
You're not friends on Facebook
Sat 7:04?PM
Hi Tom – regarding cleaning instructions for my heirloom mah-jong set. If you use the scrubbing bubbles on the case and the tile boxes, how do you rinse it off. It seems like it’s cardboard or pressboard that it’s made of.
Thanks for your help.
If you reply, Ruth S will also be able to call you and see info like your Active Status and when you've read messages.
Block Delete

囧 Hi, Ruth!
You should NOT use Scrubbing Bubbles on a case or box or anything cardboard or pressboard. Especially in combination with water!!
I'm adding this advice to FAQ 7o, where Sandy Beach suggested using Scrubbing Bubbles to clean racks (maybe that's where you got the Scrubbing Bubbles reference?). Good luck cleaning your set.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 27, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Can somebody claim that redeemable tile to redeem a joker with it?

On Wednesday, October 23, 2024 at 01:35:24 PM EDT, Cheryl M wrote:
Subject: A Mah Jongg
Good afternoon, Tom! My Mah Jongg group has a question for you. One player had a Kong of three 9 craks with a joker included. Another player, failing to see the opportunity to exchange the nine crak she had just drawn for the joker, laid the 9 crak on the table. Can the player with the Kong already exposed pick up that 9 crak and exchange it for the joker?
Sent from my iPhone

No, Cheryl. A redeemable tile can NOT be claimed and used to redeem a joker. For a more detailed answer, see FAQ 19-G.2..
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 23, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Do you think they were made in China?

On Monday, October 21, 2024 at 05:04:21 AM EDT, Lisa J wrote:
Subject: Question for you
Tom,
Hello! I have a new set of tiles, and I was wondering if you could maybe date them. The set is complete, except one flower is missing :(
I didn't send a photo from the side, but they are dovetails - bamboo and bone. Do you think they were made in China?
Thank you,
Lisa

Yes, I do. About 100+/- years ago.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 21, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I know the rule, but show me the rule, part 2

On Friday, October 18, 2024 at 08:38:45 PM EDT, betsy n wrote:
Subject: Re: Hi Tom,I know the rules but need an impartial ruling.
Thanks Tom
Thank you,
•* *~
Bettyann S
.• * *~:
'The happiest of people don't necessarily
have the best of everything;
They just make the most of everything they have!

You're welcome, Bettyann!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom

Oopsie! Backsies?

On Wednesday, October 16, 2024 at 10:15:55 PM EDT, Carolyn wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: one of our players declared mahjong. As he started his exposure he realized he didn’t have it. He did not expose all his tiles. Is his hand dead even though he did not expose all or can he put them back in his rack and continue to play? Thanks, Carolyn
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Carolyn! See FAQ 19-AM.5. If he put any tiles atop the rack, that's an unretractable move. If he can make an exposure from the discard (if he didn't put up any tiles that don't match the discard), then he can change his call from mah-jongg to exposure. Otherwise, he may have shot himself in the foot. (I mean, if he can't change his call to one legal exposure, his hand is indeed dead.)
This answer is adapted from the official rulebook, MJME2023, p.20, rule 3.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 16, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Confused by MCR scoring, part 2

On Wednesday, October 16, 2024 at 03:42:18 PM EDT, Deb Q wrote:
Subject: Re: Mahjong scoring
Thank you!

You're welcome!

Confused by MCR scoring

On Wednesday, October 16, 2024 at 02:19:47 PM EDT, Deb Q wrote:
Subject: Mahjong scoring
Hi Tom,
I am new to mahjong, and I am playing with my two friends whose mother played competitive mahjong. They are much more familiar with the game, but we are struggling with keeping score accurately. We are playing Chinese mahjong.
We all bought your book the red dragon and west wind, but we are still confused when we try to score.
Our questions is: Is there an app that we can use to help is score accurately?
Thank you for your time.
Deb

Hi, Deb! Thank you for purchasing my book. I'm sorry if the description of scoring starting on page 174 is confusing in any way. If you would like, you can send me an example of a hand you had difficulty scoring and I can walk you through it.
But you asked for an app. I checked FAQ 5 just now, the MCR section (there are many Chinese mah-jongg variants, and the one I describe in my book is MCR, Majiang Competition Rules): https://sloperama.com/mjfaq/mjfaq05.html#CO. I saw some scoring aids listed there, but they're old, so before I could tell you to check there, I needed to remove dead links and do a Google search for you, and update that FAQ. So I just added/updated these there:
If you are an Android user, look for Mahjong Scoring MCR in the Google Play store.
If you are an iPhone/iPad user, look for Mahjong Helper in the Apple App store.
There is a scoring "tutor" for MCR online at mahjong-o-matic. It gives you a series of mah-jongg hands, and asks you if they are worth the minimum eight points. Don't click the "Discard" link at the top of the page there – it doesn't work anymore. Just now, Mahjong-o-Matic showed me that I've gotten very rusty at MCR scoring! It's been seven years since the last tournament I played in...
Anyway, I hope this helps!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 16, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

In a concealed hand, can you claim a discard for mah-jongg?

On Wednesday, October 16, 2024 at 09:19:19 AM EDT, PEG C wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
In a concealed hand … can you pickup a discarded tile for mah Jong ?
Peg
If history repeats itself, I am soooooo
Getting a dinosaur.

Yes.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 16, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I know the rule, but show me the rule!

On Wednesday, October 16, 2024 at 12:01:24 AM EDT, betsy n wrote:
Subject: Hi Tom,I know the rules but need an impartial ruling.
1- If someone is about to throw out a one crak, says "one" but does not finish naming and the tile has not gone near the table at all...can they make the exchange, having caught themselves before fully naming the tile?
2- where is that rule- do u have the link?
3- Here's the tough one.....
similarly..... there is a tile with a very short name ..."red" the person said "re" but never finished naming it.... arguably dependent on what the table thinks they heard..... or what they feel inclined to say they heard..... then what? The exchanger swore in a friendly / strict game.... she only began to name it.....
This has been bothering me for awhile.
Thank you,
•* *~
Bettyann S
.• * *~:
'The happiest of people don't necessarily
have the best of everything;
They just make the most of everything they have!

Hi, Bettyann!
1. Yes they can. That tile has not been fully named, and it has not touched the table.
2. You can find that rule in these four places:
a. FAQ 19.am.3.
b. RDWW - p. 65 (rule 109), p. 99
c. MJME2023 - p. 17 (rule 4).
d. Column 499.
3. She didn't say "...d" so she didn't name it completely. If somebody wants to argue against that, you're playing in an extra-competitive group!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 16, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Help date it please

On Saturday, October 12, 2024 at 01:57:47 PM EDT, Lianne E wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
I have a mahjong set (for about 20 years).
I’ve laid it out as you suggest and see a whole line missing. One blank piece has been used as 3 BAMS. It came in an old box which is falling apart and a lot of sticks and Dice. I’m not sure if the numbers have been written a few of them after the purchase or whether made that way.
Are you able to help date it please and is there a whole line missing that I need to replace before I can learn the rules and start to play?
Thankyou in advance

Hi, Lianne!
1. It's from the 1920s.
2. You're not missing a row. Four of your blank tiles are actually White Dragon tiles.
3. Leave out the fifth blank and the set is ready to play. You can play any Asian variant except Vietnamese. You can't play modern American (NMJL) rules with that set because it would also need 8 joker tiles.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 12, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

What if no one had three tiles, part 2

On Monday, October 7, 2024 at 05:41:28 PM EDT, Pat B wrote:
Subject: Re: Charleston question
Thank you so much. That makes perfect sense.
Sent from my iPad

Good, I'm glad!
Tom

What if no one had three tiles to start the last Blind Pass?

On Monday, October 7, 2024 at 02:02:48 PM EDT, Pat B wrote:
Subject: Charleston question
On our last pass to the right, everyone was waiting to do a blind pass, but no one had three tiles to start it. What do we do? Everyone pass only two tiles? (This was not the optional across). Thank you
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Pat!
Yes, everybody should pass their two tiles to the right. But then you should all pass one more to the right after receiving those two tiles.
I came up with an "I.O.U." solution to this sort of Blind Pass quandary in 2012, and the League adopted it as a rule in 2020. See Column 534. In the NMJL rulebook (2023 edition), see the Note on page 13.
Any way you can manage to have each player pass three tiles, even if not all three at the same time, solves the Blind Pass quandary.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 2, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

How should we rule this situation in our Super Joker table rules?

On Sunday, October 6, 2024 at 01:14:05 PM EDT, Bev G wrote:
Subject: Big/Super joker
Hello Tom,
Our group of three tables play at the public library in our small town.  A few years ago we added two blank tiles to our sets to use as Super Jokers which can be used in any hand on the card.  Our house rule, because it's fun.
 This dilemma actually came up this week. 
Question:  I have three Bams displayed with one Super Joker to make a Kong, it's my turn to pick from the wall. If I were to pick another Bam I could use it to replace the Super Joker which I  would place  in my hand on my rack, but, my pick is a regular joker.  Can I exchange my newly picked (regular) joker, for the Super Joker and place the Super Joker in my hand ? 
Thanks for your Mahjongg expertise.
Bev

囧 Gosh, Bev, like I wrote in FAQ 14, The Three Rules on Table Rules, since you folks made up your own rule, you need to figure out all its ramifications yourselves. But in this case, I think maybe I see something a little differently than the naysayers in your group do.
We have to begin with the National Mah Jongg League's rules, as a foundation. Your Super Joker feature was built on that foundation.
The NMJL's joker redemption rule is that an exposed joker can be redeemed with a natural tile that fits the exposure. Right?
In your rules, you have two types of jokers: regular NMJL jokers and your custom Super Jokers. Both of them may be used in an exposure, which is how you came to your quandary. I assume in your rules, a Super Joker can be redeemed with a natural, are you with me, am I on track?
A regular NMJL joker is a more powerful tile than the natural tiles. A natural tile may be used to redeem an exposed NMJL joker.
A regular NMJL joker is, I assume, not as powerful as a Super Joker (because, you know: "Super"). I suppose the Super Joker has uses that regular jokers don't. Because it's Super.
To me, it would be consistent (based on this hierarchy of tile power) to permit redeeming a Super Joker with an ordinary NMJL joker. The concept is the same: using a less-powerful tile to obtain a more-powerful tile, when exposed atop a rack.
But the decision belongs to your group.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 6, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

What's the make and model of this particular table?

On Tuesday, October 1, 2024 at 12:37:54 AM EDT, Albert G wrote:
Subject: Q&A
Hi, on your site where you talk about the various tables and autotables that exist, there's an image of a particular mahjong table. I was just curious if you have any other information as to where this particular table is from, such as a model number or any other images or materials.

囧 Gosh, Albert, that photo is twenty years old, and so is that part of the Tables FAQ (I should really edit out the outdated information in that FAQ). That particular twenty-year-old table was made in Japan for the Japanese market; it's safe to assume that it's no longer being manufactured or supported.
I don't know the make and model of that particular machine. So I'm sorry, but I can't answer the question you asked today.
The situation with automatic tables has changed a lot since that FAQ was written. Back then, they were astounding exotic artifacts from across the sea. Today, there are hundreds of homes in America that have one. There are manufacturers who offer automatic tables in America today, and the prices are lower today than they were twenty years ago. Twenty years ago, tables of that sort were primarily manufactured for a limited market: commercial mah-jongg parlors in Japan and other parts of Asia. Today they're available for American consumers, and I recommend you look into modern machines and modern sources.
Go for the low-hanging fruit rather than the twenty-years-gone chimera. As I mentioned to Dolores K on September 10, below, Frank Du represents a table manufacturer, and he is active on Facebook. You can just send him a friend request on Facebook and ask him questions. If you want to price-shop, you could check out the manufacturer listings in that FAQ, but it might be easier to join one or more mah-jongg groups on Facebook and ask around. Frank's Facebook profile is at https://www.facebook.com/rong.du2
Albert, I'm sorry that my site is so bloated with old information, and that I'm not more gung-ho about modernizing it and cleaning out the cobwebs.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
October 1, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Clarification on "All Types"

On Sunday, September 29, 2024 at 01:12:28 PM EDT, Sandi M wrote:
Subject: Clarification of an "All Types" hand
Dear Tom,
Our Mahjong group uses "The Red Dragon & The West Wind" as our official Chinese Mahjong rule book. There has been confusion regarding what constitutes an "All Types" hand. Your rule book on pg 186 #52 All Types states: "Hand contains sets (including pairs) of each suit, and winds and dragons. May combine with Seven Pairs."
Since your example only shows one pair, some in our group think only one pair can be allowed. The term using the plural (including pairs) is used, and the fact that it can be combined with Seven Pairs; others say you can have more than one pair in the hand.
Your input will be greatly appreciated!!!
Thanks,
Sandi M

Hi, Sandi! I understand the confusion, since my book only shows one illustration of each hand. For #52, All Types, I chose to illustrate it as the most common "shape" of a hand: four sets and a pair.

In Chinese mah-jongg, there's no such thing as a hand with two, three, four, five, or six pairs. It's either one or seven!
In Chinese mah-jongg, there are five types of tiles that can be used in the hand: dots, craks, bams, winds, and dragons. As long as the hand has tiles from each of those types, it qualifies. Here's an example of how Five Types could combine with Seven Pairs:

So I help that satisfies the confusion! Keep on playing, and may the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 29, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Backsies! Undo! Do-over! (FAQ19#undo")

On Wednesday, September 25, 2024 at 03:06:17 PM EDT, <kathleen.h wrote:
Subject: Mah Jongg Question
Hi Tom
Our group was playing the other day. One person called for a tile. Put the tile up on her rack with her other tiles. Then she said she changed her mind and didn't want that tile, wanting to return it to the table. Once you call for a tile & place it on your rack it is a done deal, correct? I would like the official rule so I can show her. Thank You
Kathleen

You are correct, Kathleen. Show her FAQ 19-AM, the "change of heart" rules.

The rule is on p. 18, rule 13.
There's really no good reason why there shouldn't be a copy of the rulebook at every table.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 25, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I have been asked to find out any thing, part 6

On Monday, September 23, 2024 at 10:38:13 PM EDT, Ron G wrote:
Re: Mahjong pictures
Ok sir no problem , I know my mom is looking for a value and I’m not even sure if that is something you do, or maybe point me in the right direction to find someone to appraise it and if possible an approx year it was made we have a little documentation on it when the they came over from England to USA so I guess that would be a great help sir and thanks again Ronnie G

Okay, so you want to know how much it might be worth. Value depends on completeness, condition, beauty/rarity, and demand (what the market will bear at the time of sale).
Completeness? It has the tiles, except maybe one. It has most of the bits and pieces. I have to assume there's no coffin lid. I have to assume maybe one of the wind discs is missing or maybe a part of the black wind disc container (the "mingg"). The booklet is apparently not present.
Condition? The tiles look like VG (Very Good) but pictures cannot tell me what condition the wood case is. I assume the front slide slides into place easily and slides out easily. I have to assume the box has the original handle.
Beauty/rarity? It's reasonably attractive. It's not rare.
Demand? These old sets are mainly of interest to collectors, not players. (Plastic tiles are more pleasant to play with on a regular basis.)
I would say the set's value is in the low hundreds (somewhere between $100 and $300), depending on how much a buyer wants it for their collection. And assuming my assumptions are not far off as to missing parts, the condition of the box...
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 23, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I have been asked to find out any thing, part 5

On Monday, September 23, 2024 at 10:22:09 PM EDT, Ron G wrote:
Subject: Re: Mahjong pictures
Hello sir , I’m sorry if I didn’t get it right but as I said I’m kind of new to this so I’m going to go back to mom’s and read your email to retake some pic’s and get better pic’s to answer as much as I can sir and I will do my best to get you what you need and also have the questions as well thanks for your time . Ronnie G

Ron, I don't need better pictures. I don't need any more pictures. I just need questions. What else do you want to know?
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 23, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I have been asked to find out any thing, part 4

On Monday, September 23, 2024 at 08:15:17 PM EDT, Ron G wrote:
Subject: Mahjong pictures
Hello sir unfortunately I’m a much better mechanic than I am at using computers or smart phones so I hope these pic’s are ok and thank you Ronnie G

On Monday, September 23, 2024 at 08:17:44 PM EDT, Ron G wrote:
Subject: (No Subject)
Download all attachments as a zip file

Your pictures are pretty good, Ron, but they don't tell me everything. They don't tell me what questions you have for me. They don't tell me whether any bits are missing in the "bits and pieces" drawer. They don't tell me whether the front slide slides nicely into place.
But they do tell me some things. You have all the tiles you're supposed to have, except you seem to be missing an 8th blank tile (you have four in place as white dragons, and it looks like only 3 of them, one discolored, are in the "bits and pieces" drawer. Your pictures show that the condition of your tiles is not perfect, and not terrible. So: their condition is "VERY GOOD - Item has a few defects that any normal person would notice upon close examination." It looks like you have four tiny dice in the tiny dice coffin, but the lid of the coffin is missing or lost? Your photo shows me that you do have some of the wind indicator discs and the "mingg," but I don't know if all 4 discs are there plus the mingg's lid and bottom to contain the 4 discs. It looks like you have some extra dice in the set. I don't know if any of the scoring sticks are missing, but those parts are of less concern.
Although it is a Babcock set, it is apparently missing the "little red book" that's supposed to be in there.
Ron, you didn't ask me any questions. If you want to know something else, ask.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 23, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I have received different answers, part 2

On Sunday, September 22, 2024 at 01:57:05 PM EDT, Mary Ann C wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Hi Tom
Thank you for the information. You are our gospel for the correct rules.
Mary Ann
Sent from my iPad

You're welcome, Mary Ann!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom

I have received different answers to this question

On Sunday, September 22, 2024 at 01:13:50 PM EDT, Mary Ann C wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
I have received different answers to this question: If I pick from the wrong end of the wall, do I have to have racked it to be dead or am I dead simply because I picked from the wrong end of the wall?
Thank you, Mary Ann

Hi, Mary Ann! You received different answers, you say. Was one of those answers from the National Mah Jongg League? If so, that one's the answer. If you posted your question on social media and got different answers, well, that's to be expected, because people who are not knowledgeable of the rules will answer with their opinion.
All I can do is transcribe the actual rule for you, verbatim.

From MJME 2023, page 19, rule 15 (i): If a player picks from the wrong wall and a tile from the wrong wall is racked, the player who picked the tile now has a "dead" hand.
So there's your answer. Don't you wish the people on social media who answer rules questions all had a copy of the official rulebook?
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
Autumnal Equinox, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

What if a player picks her mahj tile and another player calls the live discard? ("Conflicting self-pick and call")

On Saturday, September 21, 2024 at 09:47:17 AM EDT, Hedy G wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
While playing I was on call for MJ. The player before discarded, I picked and while I was bringing the tile towards me, and said oh, Mah Jongg loud and clear, but I did not rack, the next player in turn called for the previous tile. I believed it was mine because I declared MJ. The player who through the tile said no because I hadn’t racked. This has happened once before. Same players, same scenario. And I gave in then and I gave in this time because I did not want to have an argument. I allowed the player to get her tile and she exposed and threw. The next in turn picked my tile, looked around and then threw the tile and I of course declared MJ, which truly pissed off the other player. And as I said it happened once before in exactly the same fashion. Btw, I was jokerless so of course I wanted that self picked win. Was I correct? The NMJL told me I was correct but I would like your opinion, thank you…
Hedy G
Sent from my iPad

Wow, Hedy! As I was reading your email, I was thinking "mahj trumps everything, you said mahj and that should end it, but to really be sure, you ought to ask the League," but then you said the League already told you that and you want ME to confirm the League's ruling? Wow! The League is in charge of their rules, not me. But I appreciate the faith you put in my opinion. I hope the League told you that in writing, so that you can prove the ruling to your group!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
Last day of summer, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Where is the rule permitting or forbidding unnecessary exposing?

On Saturday, September 21, 2024 at 08:25:12 AM EDT, Jim V wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A: exposing unnecessarily but intentionally
My mah-jongg question or comment is: a number of new players want to make any of their pungs/kongs/quints or other groupings and then put them atop their rack. These are groupings that have been made behind the scenes and not from claiming a discarded tile. Strategically I know this is a terrible idea but where in MJME or the annual bulletins is it printed that this is or is not allowed?
I have the 2023 printed edition and the last 2 years of bulletins and just cannot find anything expressly forbidding such a practice.
If you know of a specific place in the rules, please let me know.
Sincerely,
Jim V
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Jim! The rulebook describes the rules of exposing on pages 14-15. It never mentions making an exposure from a picked/drawn wall tile, so therefore (since it is not mentioned at all), making an exposure from a picked/drawn wall tile is NOT part of the rules! It should make logical sense that players cannot do something that is not part of the rules. The League tries to keep the rulebook short, so it does not go into every possible newbie misunderstanding, many of which are based on how Rummy's rules work.
The way I explain this to my students is to say that exposing is not a happy sign of progress but rather a price you must pay, for the privilege of calling a discard. The rulebook doesn't express the concept that way, but to an experienced player, that's clearly the way it works.
I explain to my students that once a player has made one exposure, opponents have a little strategic information that might be used against the exposed player, and once a player has made two exposures, opponents can tell a LOT about how to defend against that exposed player. I tell students that a tile grouping (a pung or kong or quint) hidden in the hand is one's "happy secret." This strategic explanation, with its accompanying cute little phrase, often helps students understand why they shouldn't expose unless from a discard.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
Last day of summer, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I have been asked to find out any thing, part 3

On Monday, September 16, 2024 at 05:13:33 PM EDT, Ron G wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: Hello Mr Tom bills post is very helpful also the pic’s in FAQ 710 looks to be identical to what my mother has but I’m going to get photo’s and send them sir. Thanks again Ronnie

Okay. Standing by...
Tom

I have been asked to find out any thing, part 2

On Monday, September 16, 2024 at 04:16:10 PM EDT, Ron G wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: Hello again and thanks so much for the guidance also would I email pictures to this board as well sir and once again thank you for your advice ! Ronnie 

Yes, you would email the pictures to me - you can use your gmail and you can just reply to my email. Have you read FAQ 7-H and FAQ 7-G? Depending on what questions you'll ask, there is specific information I need from you, which is outlined in those FAQs. And if you send pictures of tiles, the tiles need to be ORGANIZED. An excellent example is below, the September 14 post from billb.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 16, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I have been asked to find out any thing I could

On Sunday, September 15, 2024 at 06:28:02 PM EDT, Ron G wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:Hello sir my name is Ronnie and honestly all I know of the game is what I’ve been researching for the past week. My mother (86) was given my great grandparents Mah-jong game they came big from England in 1906 with this box it has the sliding frt panel and 6 drawers she has asked me to find out any thing I. Could,could you guide me where to go  from here thank you 

Hi, Ronnie! These links should get you started:
● Column 610 discusses typical 1920s mah-jongg sets
● FAQ 7 discusses types of sets, what they're made of, the tiles, the extra pieces in mah-jongg sets, and much more.
If you want me to look at your set to answer other questions, make sure to send good pictures of a reasonable large size (minimum 1024 pixels at the widest dimension).
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 15, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Help identifying age, part 2

On Sunday, September 15, 2024 at 06:13:21 AM EDT, billb wrote:
Subject: Re: Help Identifying Age of Mah Jong Set
Hi Tom,
Thanks for the quick reply. You do have a great site. I’ve gotten enough of an education to at least have a clue if I encounter another set.
Regards,
Bill

Thanks and you're welcome, Bill.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom

Help identifying age of Mah Jong set. Oh, and value, too.

On Saturday, September 14, 2024 at 06:53:10 PM EDT, <billb wrote:
Subject: Help Identifying Age of Mah Jong Set
Hi Tom,
First of all I knew nothing about Mah Jong or Mah Jong sets before checking your site so what knowledge I have comes from perusing your site (very nice). I’ve attached several images.
I picked the set up at a local flea market recently because they looked old. They do show a lot of wear from use. It only included the box and tiles.
The set contains 140 tiles so I’m guessing it’s intended for the Japanese Market. It came in the wood box with slide on top shown in the images
The tiles appear to me to be Chinese Bakelite (fish Bone?) They are 1.24 in. tall by .93 in. wide by .686 in. deep and very heavy. Each tile weighs .6 oz. and the set in the box weighs 7lbs.
I would say they are in fair condition. Someone wrote numbers on the craks and reversed the 5s and 8s (wrote 5 on each of the 8s and 8 on each of the 5s.
140 tiles total. 36 Dots 36 Craks (the new style) 36 Bams 16 winds 8 Dragons 4 Blanks and 4 of what I believe are flowers.
I’ve attached all the requested images and attempted to name them appropriately.
Any info on age / value would be appreciated. Right now I’m guessing 70s – 80s and not much. Thanks.
Regards,
Bill

Hi, Bill!
Those "Applejuice" Bakelite tiles were popular decades ago. I can't be sure, but probably anytime between the 1930s and 1960s. The wooden box backs up that estimate; later Chinese sets came in cheaper plastic cases. The set was made for local sale in China, since it has no Western indices and the box is cheaply made. I would agree with you that it's in Fair condition. It's utilitarian, at least for Asian players who don't use flowers or might use just four, but not attractive, since two of the tiles are badly discolored. Anyone who plays with the set will quickly learn that a dark tile in the wall or in someone's hand is either a white dragon or a four-bam. And players would have to supply their own dice.
It's an oddity that a previous owner mislabeled the 5 craks and 8 craks. Some collectors appreciate odd quirks in an old set, but I imagine that a collector interested in the set would mainly use it for spare parts, to Frankenstein a complete set. I imagine such a collector would be unlikely to pay more than $50 for it. Nice job on the pictures, by the way! Thanks for that.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 14, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

The 2024 NMJL card, part 12

On Wednesday, September 11, 2024 at 05:37:30 PM EDT, Joan O wrote:
Subject: 2024 card
Hi our group is asking about 369 - 4th one down.
Understand the two suits.   The Pungs w/ matching dragons.
Can you use 1 set of 666 green and 1 set of 999 red?
Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

No, Joan. They have to be both pungs of threes, OR both pungs of sixes, OR both pungs of nines. See FAQ 16, answers about the 2024 NMJL card.

Please bookmark FAQ 16 for future reference.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 11, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I am interested in purchasing an automatic table

On Tuesday, September 10, 2024 at 08:51:19 AM EDT, Dolores K wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
I am interested in purchasing an automatic table for in home use. I don't find any made in the USA. Do you recommend a certain company? Do you recommend certain features built into a table?
With a table being a bit difficult to return (for any reason), I would appreciate any advice you might offer.
Thank you!
Dee

Hi, Dee! I mentioned Frank Du in FAQ 7-F, where I have listed several manufacturers of automatic mah-jongg tables. I checked just now and found that the aotomo.com website is no longer online, but Frank is active on Facebook. You can just send him a friend request on Facebook and ask him questions. If you want to price-shop, you could look into other manufacturers in FAQ 7-F and join one or more mah-jongg groups on Facebook and ask around. I've updated the link to his company in the FAQ. Most manufacturers now support Americans' need for 152 tiles, and I'm pretty sure they have American suppliers now. You'll be the envy of your mah-jongg group when you have one of those marvelous toys!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 10, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Jim May

On Monday, September 9, 2024 at 03:55:38 PM EDT, Georgia T wrote:
Subject: Jim May
Is jim May still a collector of mahj sets?
I'm having trouble finding info on him
I collect as well
Thanks
Georgia Taylor

I'm not certain, Georgia. I was under the impression that he sold his collection and that he also sold or gave his website to someone. I think the website went to CHarli, whose website is at www.charli.org/Museum/index.html. At the very least, CHarli would probably be able to tell you more about what has become of Jim.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
9/9/2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Robbing one's own kong, part 3

On Monday, September 9, 2024 at 09:58:17 AM EDT, lorr16 wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Thanks so much for explaining that.
Cheers
Lorraine  
Sent from my Galaxy

You're welcome, Lorraine!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom

Robbing one's own kong, part 2

On Monday, September 9, 2024 at 09:04:31 AM EDT, lorr16 wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Hi Tom,
We use "The Mahjong Players Companian" by Patricia A. Thompson and Betty Maloney.
We don't score and just enjoy the game at our local social and sporting  club.
When playing  my friend Cal made an exposed kong of 8 bamboos which is displayed on her board so everyone can see it, I know the other players can take it to go Mahjong but Cal later in the game realised she could Mahjong if she robbed her own kong.Is it allowed to take your own kong.
Many thanks
Lorraine 
Mandurah 
Western Australia 

I see, Lorraine! I can see clearly now.
After a kong has been exposed and the next player takes a turn, that kong can no longer be robbed. Robbing the Kong is a one-chance deal, a play available only at the precise moment that the kong is made, by promotion from a pung. None of the players can rob that long-ago-exposed kong, including the player whose kong it is. Cal should not have made a kong in the first place, if she could later use one of its tiles in a chow.
The Mah Jong Players' Companion is primarily just a list of hands and their scores. Thompson & Maloney's other book, The Game of Mah Jong, Illustrated, describes the Robbing the Kong rule on page 20, rule 18. I recommend someone in your group purchase a copy of that book.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
9/9/2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Robbing one's own kong

On Monday, September 9, 2024 at 03:24:40 AM EDT, lorr16 wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Recently a player made a kong with a discarded tile so the forth tile was exposed. She then needed that tile to go Mahjong. I know you can do this from someone else's kong but can you do it from your own kong?
Many thanks Lorraine 
Sent from my Galaxy

G'day, Lorraine. I'm still on my first coffee of the morning, so it took me a while to wrap my head around your question. I gather that you're asking about "robbing a kong," is that right? So you're playing an Asian variant, possibly British/Australian rules. A.D. Millington defines the play as robbing someone else's fourth tile, at the moment of that player promoting an exposed pung to a kong, using a tile drawn from the wall (not from a discard).
I can't picture the scenario you described, and I can't picture a scenario under which someone could rob one's own kong to win. And as the rule is defined by Millington, you can't promote an exposed pung to a kong with someone else's discard in the first place.
Given the above, I would say no, you cannot rob your own kong to win. Two caveats:
1. I would need a clearer picture of the event you're describing - including what tiles the player was holding and what the winning hand would look like (how can one tile be both part of a kong and yet used somewhere else in the hand, and why would someone first promote a pung rather than just say mah-jongg). You probably didn't record that level of detail.
2. Millington's book describes Chinese Classical rules. That variant is the "mother of all variants," so as far as I can say, Millington's definition applies pretty much across the board. Still, to be sure, I'd need to know which variant you play, specifically which author wrote the book your group uses as its "bible."
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
9/9/2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Trying to find out how old they are.

On Saturday, September 7, 2024 at 12:58:44 AM EDT, Lisa J wrote:
Mah-Jongg Q+A
Hello! I have a partial set of MJ tiles, and I was trying to find out how old they are. Hoping you could help.
This is the info I do have:
1. This is a partial set containing 36 Bam tiles, 12 Dragons, 4 Flowers, and 3 Big-Jokers. (photos attached).
2. No paper materials were included
3. Made of Bakelite
4. No historical information
5. Dimensions 1 1/4" x 3/4" x 1/2" (photos attached)
6. No of tiles (see #1)
7. No container
8. No crack tiles
9. One Bam - photo attached
10. Dragons- photo attached
11. Flowers/Seasons- photo attached
12. Jokers - - photo attached
I really appreciate you taking the time to look at my tiles. Thank you!
Lisa

Hi, Lisa!
Odd, isn't it, that two of the suits and all of the winds and a bunch of other tiles all went somewhere else. Sometimes I try to imagine what must have happened. It was common in the 1940s and 1950s to cannibalize sets to sticker them into flowers because of the NMJL's growing "hunger" for flowers (check out column 509). But your collection still has some flowers and even manufactured jokers (so odd that you have just three!). I'm not an expert on manufacturers, so I can't tell you which company made your set with those "Big Jokers," or which years they made those jokers. I'd guess that your tiles were made in the 1950s or early 1960s. If this isn't specific enough for your needs, you could try checking the "Other Excellent Mah-Jongg Sites" part of FAQ 4a. CHarli's or Gregg's sites might be able to give you more information. There are mah-jongg groups on Facebook, too.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 8, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Shu Qibo's alternative mah-jongg tiles

On Saturday, September 7, 2024 at 10:03:44 PM EDT, nick g wrote:
Subject: Mahjong Q&A
hi Tom! I love your site. I just picked up this seemingly unique set, i think it's from the 90s and definitely chinese. Instead of honor tiles, there is a fourth red star suit! it's a nice set and the tiles are of very good quality. The insert mentions that the designer wanted to make a game with less of a gambling connotation. If you search his name, you can see that he indeed patented this knockoff of the game and it was written about in a local journal -  https://www.tongxianghuicn.com/article/818477.jhtml?libId=814
anyway, just wanted to contribute to the archive and wondered if you'd seen this before! it's odd to me that he tried to make a new variant but the rest of the tiles are all totally normal. the case is a heavy plastic matching in teal with 1-bam birds on the closures
thanks for your work!
nick g
Download all attachments as a zip file

Hi, Nick!
I have one of those sets in my collection. It's not the only set in my collection that uses non-traditional tile designs. Mah-jongg has two problems:
1. The tiles are daunting, a "barrier to entry," according to some people*
2. In its homeland, China, mah-jongg has a strong association with the evils and illegality of gambling.
So according to the article, Shu Qibo designed this set to solve at least the second problem. Others have endeavored to solve the first. More on that in a bit.
I followed your link and saw that the page is in Chinese. I used the browser's translation feature:

XiangXiangwen Volume period (): Issue 37
Publishing date: 2010-02-01
Publishing cycle: Annual
Opening: 16 open
Author: Wang Hua
Number of article pages: 2 pages
Number of articles: 1342 words
Browsing times: 65 Times
Downloads: 0 Times
Unfortunately, your organization does not have permission to read the resource, please contact
Disclaimer:
This library contains periodicals in the Taiwan region. In order to provide researchers with original materials, this library preserves the original appearance and has not been deleted. It does not mean that this library agrees with the author's views and terms. Please identify!
New brand new play method New brand new player - Book Politic sports inventor Shu Qibo
Summary:
This is a new sports project that has received state expertise and is supported by state agencies. This is a new device that combines fun, puzzle and game one. This is an athletic device that retains both the traditional state and the spirit of innovation. This is the —— Polaroid Concession License. In order to respond to the instructions of the National Sports Bureau to include mahjong in the normal sports program, Shu Jibo has a 50-year mahjong actual combat experience. Based on the appearance and style of the old mahjong, it has been removed from the east, west, north, Chinese, Feng, Spring, Summer, Autumn, Winter, May, Lan, Ju, Bamboo and other cards with strong gamboo have developed Poly.
Keywords: Polyco Patent Sports | Mahjong's new gameplay | New sports

I didn't find those images on the site you linked, but it doesn't matter. I don't know why the translation mentions "Polaroid," but it doesn't matter. The thing I see in these alternate sets is point #1 above, the one with the asterisk.
* I disagree that the traditional tile designs are a problem that needs to be solved. It takes only one or two lessons with a teacher to overcome that. For many players and even people who might want to learn, the tile designs are intriguing because they are so exotic. And the tile designs people like Shu Qibo and others come up with are no less daunting, no less a "barrier to entry." The only suit designs that would seem less off-putting would be to use playing card suits: spades, hearts, clubs, diamonds. But only three of those could be used, and which three? The winds and dragons and flowers still have to be dealt with. Interesting that Shu Qibo got rid of them and added a fourth suit instead. He probably (I can't read Chinese) designed rules to do away with those even more "troublesome" tiles.
I see the whole thing as a tempest molehill in a teapot mountain. To mix metaphors. Which is kind of what Shu Qibo's tile set does.
May the tiles be with you, Nick.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 8, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

This exchange has been added to the "Mystery Tiles" FAQ.

About saying the name of the tile you're redeeming

On Saturday, September 7, 2024 at 06:27:28 PM EDT, Sue Z wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Tom –
I have a question about your response to Jean on 8/27/24 regarding a Joker exchange.
You said -- Player 1: "Here's a One Dot. Let me have that Joker from your exposure of One Dots, please."
The verbalization of the exchange begins with the words “Here’s a ”, which clearly indicate the intent to do a Joker exchange, but then you immediately fully name the tile “…One Dot.”, which ordinarily commits the player to discarding. Since the action of intent (“Here’s…”) occurs before the action of discarding (fully naming the tile), can the Joker exchange proceed?
I always teach my students that you never verbalize the name of a tile you intend to exchange to prevent any possible confusion about being committed to discarding rather than exchanging.
What are your thoughts?
Thanks so much.
Sue Z

Hi, Sue!
I teach my students the same thing. When redeeming a joker, it's best practice not to make a mistake that can be construed as a discard instead. I shouldn't have said "here's a one dot," but rather "I'd like to redeem your joker with this one dot, please." Saying it that way (or some other way that specifically mentions joker redemption, before saying the tile's name) communicates that redemption is the intended act, not discarding. And I'll go back to my 8/27/24 post and make that correction.
It should go without saying that I was just expressing concepts to illustrate an occurrence; the words I chose originally were more by way of exposition (of painting a visual picture) than a precise setting forth of recommended wording. In fact, nobody needs to say the tile's name at all while redeeming a joker - I just did that to paint a picture in the reader's mind of what was happening in my imagined alternative occurrence. But, way to keep me honest, Sue!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 8, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

"Backsies!" May a player call a do-over in this instance?

On Thursday, September 5, 2024 at 04:09:06 PM EDT, suzanne r wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
May a player call, display the tiles, and change their mind and take them back before they have discarded?
Sent from my iPhone

No, Suzanne. Once the tiles were displayed, the move has been irrevocably committed to. See the Backsies/Do-Over/Change of Heart rules in FAQ 19.
All the most frequently asked questions in American/NMJL mah-jongg rules are answered in FAQ 19. You might want to bookmark it for future reference.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
September 5, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Ideas for a hinge pin replacement, part 2

On Friday, August 30, 2024 at 05:51:15 PM EDT, Joanne L wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Thanks. 
Joanne

You're welcome, Joanne.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 30, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Ideas for a hinge pin replacement?

On Friday, August 30, 2024 at 03:30:21 PM EDT, Joanne L wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
I have a vintage set with a leather case with 1 inch hinges. One of the hinges is missing the pin that keeps the hinge together. How would I find a replacement?
Thank you in advance for your help. 
Joanne

Hi, Joanne! I would see if a piece of clothes hanger wire might fit, or a paper clip. Cut to length and bend the ends.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 30, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Is it improper etiquette to organize the discard pile?

On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 10:56:09 PM EDT, <susanml wrote:
Subject: Question regarding discards
Hello ! Is it improper etiquette to organize the discard pile? I played with a woman today and after each discard she either touched it and arranged it into suits in a line or required the rest of us to do this as well. It was completely maddening not to mention slowed down the play.
Thanks!
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Susan! When I join a new group, I adapt to their table rules. But it does sound like improper etiquette, if the group does not agree with it. You say she "required" the rest of you to organize discards? If the others complied with her "requirement," then it sounds like she has some sort of leadership role in the group. Sounds a lot like a post I read today in "Mah Jongg, That's It!" on Facebook:

I have just joined a new group of mahjong players. The person in charge insists that all discarded tiles must be laid in front of our racks and in a row and that we can not just place all discarded tiles together. Ever heard of such a “rule”. I don’t want my discards in front of me for everyone to see!

In Japanese riichi majan and in Chinese official Competition Rules, it's a requirement to place discards in an orderly fashion. Since I've played both of those variants, I've found that it's not an "advantage" for one player over another, since everyone is doing it.
But orderly discards is not standard practice in American (NMJL) rules, and would not be enforceable by anyone on you in an American-style tournament. If the group agrees to use it as a table rule, then what's the harm? Different tables commonly use different table rules. But if there's one bossy player at the table who's trying to force the others into a practice they don't actually like, well, I wonder why people keep playing with her. I suggest you bring it up to the group and ask for your own satisfaction if they all like it that way and what their reasoning is. Maybe you'll come to accept the table rule. Or maybe they'll tell her she's outvoted.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 29, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Age and approximate value, part 5

On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 07:01:29 PM EDT, Nick M wrote:
Subject: Re: Butterscot Mahjong Set
Thanks for your knowledge on the subject. One thing the red and green dragons are there in one of the pictures but there were only 3 of each. I assume I can find the missing parts on line. Thanks 
Sent from my iPhone

Again: those are not dragons. They're flowers, and they do not match the rest of your tiles (see how they're darker than the rest, and not exactly the same size). You can remove them from the set, but I would leave them in just for the heck of it. You certainly don't need to go to the extreme step of hunting for two more of them.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 29, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Age and approximate value, part 4

On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 10:33:35 AM EDT, Nick M wrote:
Butterscot Mahjong Set
Set in in fine condition. Not sure if set is complete. I’m sending pictures and have put tiles in sets of 4 as pictured. Dice are red translucent. There seems to be 2 dragons missing and I guess according to your website the blanks are for the white dragons. There also may be missing flowers. I don’t know how this set came to be. There are 6 bone tiles and 4 bamboo pieces different thickness. 3 of the bone tiles are dovetailed in the middle. The sticks are also bone. 2 black tiles also. All of the circles have square holes and 90% or more are embossed  4 of the holders are mahogany and one apears painted  Thanks in advance for any info 

Nick, I just found this email (which apparently was the first one you sent me) in my email Spam folder. I notice some different information (not given in the email I first replied to, below).
- You say the condition of the tiles is "Fine," rather than "good," which is what I saw in the email I received first. I'll upgrade the condition to "Very Good" for evaluation purposes, since because your photos are the smallest possible size (320x240), it's hard for me to confirm your condition assessment.
- Before, I didn't see any "1 Bam bird" tiles, but now I see them. So you are not missing those.
- You say you're missing two dragon tiles, but you are not. You've apparently confused flowers for dragons.
- Since you have 20 flower tiles, and are not missing any tiles, it looks like this set is complete enough to play modern American mah-jongg after all. However, it still looks like your flowers might not be all of the same manufacture. The value of the set depends partly on how well all the flower tiles match (and whether you can sticker eight of them as jokers, and put together 8 flowers and 8 jokers that do not look obviously different from one another when face-down). It looks like the group of 6 flowers you seem to have taken for dragons are darker than your other tiles, so those may not be suitable. You could also use blanks as jokers (you'd have to sticker them).
Since it now appears that you have not 20 but 14 flowers that actually match your other tiles, it looks like the set's date of manufacture should be revised to the mid-1940s.
You still did not say what condition the four wooden racks are in.
So I am upgrading the previous valuation to around $120-140, give or take. Anyone who buys the set will still need to buy a new case. You should still discard (or at least remove from the case) the extraneous bits I mentioned below. I would leave the six mismatched (darker) flower tiles in the set, though.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 29, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Can a joker be redeemed from a dead player's rack?

On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 04:45:59 PM EDT, Jane M wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
A player today had displayed 2 seven bams with 2 jokers and she also had displayed 4 six cracks.  A few rounds later , She  declared mahjong and showed four one dot, with 2 flowers.    We called her hand dead as the tiles had to be the same suit.    Question is would the jokers with the seven bams be considered dead also?    They were displaced earlier and we thought she was doing consecutive numbers, different suits . 
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Jane! I gather you're saying that the prior exposures were ambiguous - that it was not possible to know exactly which hand the dead player had been working on until she erroneously declared mahj. See FAQ 19-P. If those prior exposures were ambiguous, they can remain atop the rack and that means any jokers therein are available for exchange. But the improperly exposed tiles must be returned to the sloping front of the rack. This is rule 4(b) on page 22 of MJME2023.

Age and approximate value, part 3

On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 10:35:19 AM EDT, Nick M wrote:
Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Here is list. 
Set is in fine condition tiles all look good. 
45 red circles
20 white circles
34 black circles
15 green and blue circles
2 red translucent dice
4 bone 3” tiles
5 racks
2 black tiles
6 bone tiles
6 bamboo
160 butterscotch tiles
Sent from my iPhone

On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 10:36:10 AM EDT, Nick M wrote:
Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Also the case is in terrible condition. I forgot to mention that. Thanks
Sent from my iPhone

I received these emails after I posted the valuation. Most of this information was already given in your earlier email.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 29, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Age and approximate value, part 2

On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 09:47:19 AM EDT, Nick M wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
The butterscotch tiles are all in good condition. The case the set is in is in terrible condition. I’m not sure the set is complete. Here is list of what is there. 
45 red circles
20 white circles
34 black circles
15 green and blue circles
2 red translucent dice
4 bone 3” tiles
5 racks
2 black tiles
6 bone tiles
6 bamboo
160 butterscotch tiles
Any knowledge you have will be helpful. 

Nick, what you call "circles" are chips. The tiles that do not match the yellow Bakelite tiles do not belong in the set. You can discard them or try to sell them separately. The split/broken bone-and-bamboo tiles are worthless and should be discarded. The four lone bone scoring sticks are useless in this set, and can be discarded. The fifth rack that does not match the other four should also be removed from the set. Personally, I think the Bakelite tiles are in better condition than just "good," but I'll go with your "Good" assessment, since that's what you said after I told you what "Good" means. The "terrible" case is actually in "Poor" condition, maybe "Fair to Poor" since it functions. You didn't say what condition the wood racks and chips are in. I want to go with "Very Good," based on your photos, but because your photos are too small (just 640x480), I can't trust that guess.
The fact that your set has 160 yellow Bakelite tiles suggests a possible manufacturing date of Late 1950s. But that could be wrong, because your flower tiles appear to be of different manufacture.
What we are left with after removal of the extraneous pieces is a yellow Bakelite 160-tile 4-rack set in Good condition, in a Fair to Poor case. Value is around $100, give or take $20. The value is even less if there are no "1-Bam Bird" tiles in the set. Your photos do not show any. If there are none, the value is around $75 (give or take), to be sold as a fixer-upper.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 29, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Age and approximate value

On Wednesday, August 28, 2024 at 06:32:20 PM EDT, Nick M wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
If I send you pictures of a Butterscotch Mahjong game I picked up over 20 years ago. The age and approximate value. History of where and when it might have been made. Thanks for any possible info in advance.

Sure, Nick. When emailing pictures, if you're using a mobile phone or iPad, make sure the photos are large enough so I can see details. Too many people send me the smallest possible size, 320x240 pixels, can you believe that? Pictures should be AT LEAST 1024 pixels at the widest dimension. But pictures alone are not enough. I need complete CONDITION information, as defined in FAQ 7-H. Would you believe that people tell me "it's in very good condition" without realizing what "Very Good" actually means in an evaluation, and without telling me what defects cause the item to be "Very Good" instead of "Fine"? For example, the most common condition of old mah-jongg sets are:
FAIR - Item is utilitarian but not attractive. All defects must be noted.
GOOD - Item is worn but reasonably attractive; any normal person would notice the defects without having to look for them. All defects must be noted.
VERY GOOD - Item has a few defects that any normal person would notice upon close examination. All defects must be noted.
A set can also be Poor or Fine or Mint. I need you to tell me what condition the tiles are (just an overall condition of all the tiles), what condition the container is, and what condition the paper materials are (if any), and what condition the other bits and pieces are.
It's typical that an owner will be loose or generous when describing the condition of their items, but I need to be objective and truthful about an item's condition. This is important - when there are defects, I hope you will tell me honestly what they are and that I can see them myself in the photos. See the FAQ for more information on what I need, in order to give you a reasonably accurate valuation of your mah-jongg set.
Standing by!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 28, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Can someone halt a joker exchange on someone else's turn, and declare mahj on the redeemable tile?

On Tuesday, August 27, 2024 at 05:38:58 PM EDT, JEAN G wrote:
Subject: Mah Jongg question
Today one player was doing a joker redemption with a tile that would have given another player Mah Jongg. I wonder if there is ever a time one player getting Mah Jongg with a certain tile would trump the joker swapping with that same tile.

Hi, Jean! So if I understand the suggestion, a situation might go like this:
Player 1: "Here's a One Dot. Let me have that Joker from your exposure of One Dots, please." "I'd like to redeem your joker with this one dot, please."*
Player 2: "Hey wait, you can't do that! It's my mahj tile, so you have to give it to me!"
Player 1: "Oh darn, I thought for sure I was going to get my joker this time!"
Player 2: "Well, them's the rules. Hand it over."
(^o^)'

I can't imagine that such a rule would ever really exist!
In other words, to answer your question as it was asked: No, there is never such a time.
May the tiles be with you!
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 27, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

* Change in wording recommended by Sue Z in our Sept. 7-8 conversation, above.

Mystery little guys and tiles

On Tuesday, August 27, 2024 at 02:58:49 AM EDT, Karl M wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: "What are these little guys doing in my Mah-Jongg set? I have no idea on the origin of this set, but given there is no English, and and looking at your FAQ, I assume it was aimed at the Chinese market, but here it is in Australia.
Second question: What is the "green window" tile? The tiles are very "blocky", 18mm x 25mm and 12mm deep. They seem to be 50/50 wood/bone and dovetailed.
Thanks,
Karl
Melbourne, Australia

G'day, Karl!
1. I don't know. Somebody put them there, I suppose. Your photo shows one of them, but you seem to be saying that there are more than one in the set.
2. It's a white dragon. See the Mystery Tiles FAQ. It's interesting that your white dragons are green, when they're typically either blue or black in most of those old sets.
3. I assume that since you provided dimensions, there is a third question. FAQ 7-A has a section on tile sizes, and your 25x18x12mm is towards the smaller end of the typical size range. Not an unusual or remarkable size.
May the tiles be with you. Oh wait, they already are!
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 27, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Do you have to rack before you say mah-jongg?

On Thursday, August 22, 2024 at 05:02:37 PM EDT, Ekaminowitz wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: does a tile need to be racked before you can call mah jong or can you call as soon as you pick tile

Say it immediately. Whether you're talking about a live discard or a tile you just picked from the wall, say it immediately. Then put the tile atop the rack and put up the rest of your tiles. Then tell everyone which hand on the card it is and how much everyone owes you.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 22, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Conflicting claims, one for mahj (FAQ 19-I)

On Thursday, August 22, 2024 at 01:19:21 PM EDT, Ellen K wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
If someone calls mahjong but another player calls last tile is the mahjong Jong taken away
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Ellen! No, it isn't. A claim for mah-jongg is most definitely not overriden by a claim for exposure. This is stated on the back of the card, but I think it would be a good idea if you read FAQ 19-I and also FAQ 19-H, right above it, in their entirety, because the issue of conflicting claims is a HOT topic in American mah-jongg, and it has many convolutions, and is more complex than the brief description on the back of the card.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 22, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Does this fall under “use your eyes and ears” - part 2

On Tuesday, August 20, 2024 at 07:08:39 PM EDT, Shirley M wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Thanks so much for your answer and guidance!
Sent from my iPad

You're welcome, Shirley!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 20, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Does this fall under “use your eyes and ears”?

On Tuesday, August 20, 2024 at 04:09:06 PM EDT, Shirley M wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: Player A discards a 7 crack. Player B calls the discard and puts up a joker and two 7 bams but does not discard nor has she touched the discarded 7 crack. Does this fall under “use your eyes and ears”? Is player B dead or does she get to put the exposed tiles back on her rack and pick?
I’ve read through your rules explanations, but am not certain how this should be handled. I also have your book and don’t see it.
Thank you.
Shirley M
Sent from my iPad

Hi, Shirley!
This falls under "Can I change my exposure if I haven't discarded yet?" That's FAQ 19-AF. A letter from the League dated 2/20/24 (long after RDWW was published in 2007) says no, not in this case. You can amend the number of tiles but not the type of tiles. Her hand is dead. She puts the 7Bams and the joker back on the sloping front of the rack. She's out for the remainder of that game.
[Edit] See also FAQ 19-AM.2. [/edit]
Do you have the latest RDWW errata? You can download it here.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 20, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Those confusing Joker rules...

On Tuesday, August 20, 2024 at 03:06:55 AM EDT, mita g wrote:
Subject: Mah Jongg Hand Question
Hi, so glad I found your Web Site??
I teach a Mah Jongg Class at a Retirement Home.
I have two questions.
1) Can you use all jokers to form a Pong or a Kong to call Mah Jongg, or do you need at least one of the missing tiles indicated on the Card?
2)If a discard is made and it is the tile you need to form a Pong or Kong along with your Jokers can you call it?
Thank you.
Mita G
Long Beach, CA
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Mita!
1) Yes you can, and no you don't. This is a Jokers question, so see FAQ 19-L.
2) Yes you can. This also is answered in FAQ 19-L.

Frequently Asked Questions about the rules of American mah-jongg (National Mah Jongg League rules) are answered in FAQ 19.
And Frequently Asked Questions about the 2024 NMJL card are answered in FAQ 16. I recommend bookmarking FAQ 19 and FAQ 16.
And of course every teacher (and every mah-jongg table or room) should have the League's official rulebook, Mah Jongg Made Easy.

Good luck with your teaching! Hope everyone has fun.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 20, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Is this allowed in NMJL rules, part 2

On Monday, August 19, 2024 at 04:45:12 PM EDT, Pat Lanahan wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Thanks for clarifying!
Sent from my iPhone

You're welcome, Pat!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 19, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Moon at Bottom of Well, part 2

On Monday, August 19, 2024 at 03:19:11 PM EDT, Map wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Hi again Tom,
I don’t know if this is of interest but I found this on the Net; the site is no longer operational but can no doubt serve as a point of reference for the different views on the pattern-changes of hands over the years. Curiously this would have been written not long before T&M wrote their books on Mah Jong, they I believe hail from Australia and this guy is from New Zealand. As I mentioned in my previous email to you I had come across info before purchasing books on Mah Jong; it’s so long ago now I don’t know whether my original concept of the Moon at Bottom of Well hand was formed by reading this or some other site. Who knows, not I.
However, this gentleman’s description indicates the Pair as being 1’s of Circles. But as you say that would be a tall order if the hand also required a run of 1 to 9 with the fourth Chow being 1,2,3 as well.

From Google Groups
han...@waikato.ac.nz
unread,
27/10/1994
to
Hi,
a while back there was some discussion about the game of Mah Jong. So
therefore for those who are interested I have posted my list of hands from my
book "101 Illustrated Mah Jong Hands". Unfortunately these do not have any
illustrations but all the info is there. Some re-formatting will be necessary.
If you have any questions/comments please email them to me as I will be unable
to keep track of the net due to the fact of upcoming exams!!!!
Have fun
Dave Warner.
72. MOON AT THE BOTTOM OF THE WELL Score: LIMIT
Four Chows of Circles. No
Winds or Dragons.
Pair of 1 Circles.
Concealed (except last).
FISHING: Bonus of 10 points plus Flowers are doubled 3 times
for Purity and 2 times for
Concealed Mah Jong plus any extra doubles for
Flowers.

Hi, Mal. That descripton does not say that a Pure Straight is required. Just four chows of Dots. I stick by my previous recommendation: a Pure Straight plus any chow of dots plus any pair of dots. Period. Note that the hands in Western mah-jongg vary considerably from author to author and from table to table. There is no one authority putting an official stamp on any of them that are not also recognized in other older variants. T&M botched their two wildly different descriptions, so you get to decide this, in conjunction with your playing group.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 19, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Is this allowed in NMJL rules?

On Monday, August 19, 2024 at 01:57:09 PM EDT, Pat L wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:When a player call a discarded tile then exposes that tile and 3 others for her hand and then after exposure but before discarding decides to remove one of the exposed tiles. She then discards another tile . Is this legal or is she committed to the play on ce all four tiles are exposed on her rack even if she has not discarded.

Yes, Pat, it's legal. See MJME2023, p. 15.
If you don't own the rulebook, see FAQ 19-AF.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 19, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Moon at Bottom of Well

On Monday, August 19, 2024 at 01:06:06 PM EDT, Map wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Dear Tom,
Thank you for the very quick response to my enquiry yesterday about Crazy Chows which was much appreciated. So, on to my second question.
Reference to Moon at Bottom Well - pages 15 and 47 in Thompson and Maloney’s Mah Jong Players Companion.
The description on the pages suggests the hand is ‘four chows and a pair’ and all in the Circles suit. The illustration shows a long run from 1 to 9 plus a Chow 1,2,3. So we may think so far so good.
Curiously the authors in stead of clarifying the pattern of the hand on those obvious pages chose to explain the structure on page 6 under the page heading Short List. Why they chose to do this is baffling but that is not my concern.
So the hand requires three Chows running consecutively from 1 to 9. Ok, so far so good.
However, I still have issues with this hand as follows;
Does the fourth Chow have to be 1,2,3 of Circles or can it be another numbered Chow set of Circles, say 4,5,6 or 6,7,8 etc.
Curiously most Internet sites I’ve come across where they have illustrations tend I suspect to copy T&M’s graphic.
The majority of sites however just describe the hand in the same way as T&M do on pages 15&47, which indicates that the fourth Chow need not be 1,2,3 even though their graphic shows it as such and as many other sites also.
Lastly, before I managed to start playing the game properly and even before having any published hard copy reference I remember reading a couple of websites that mentioned the Moon as being the 1 of Circles and that the special hand M at B of W required the Pair to be 1 Circles also.
Any thoughts on these matters? How do you interpret the hand ?
Kind regards,
Mal J

Hi again, Mal! It's not good that T&M wrote two divergent descriptions of this hand (which appears only in this one book of theirs and in nobody else's book). You say you've found the hand described in many websites? I found just one on scribd: "4 Chows + Pair, all circle suit."
If I was you, I'd just say that the fourth chow can be any chow in Dots, the pair can be any pair of Dots. It's hard enough to have to have a Pure Straight in there without forcing specific numbers on the pair and the fourth chow.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 19, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Crazy Chows

On Sunday, August 18, 2024 at 02:58:52 PM EDT, Map wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
My Mah Jong group have been using the Thompson-Maloney companion book for reference with regards to Western Classic Special Hands. To the most part the descriptions of hand patterns match illustrations but there are a few such as Crazy Chows and Moon at Bottom of Well where descriptions and illustrations create questions.
Consider Crazy Chows which is described as three mixed Chows with a mixed pair (Knitted Pair in Western Classic parlance). The illustration however shows the Chows having a fixed pattern of suits so that the lower number in each Chow are of the same suit; the middle tiles would be a different suit and lastly the higher numbers of the Chows would be from the remaining suit. For example 1-Bamboo, 2-Characters, 3-Circles perhaps along with say 6-Bamboo, 7-Characters, 8- Circles etc. This pattern would therefore follow the Chinese Official Competition Rules Knitted Pattern Sequences i.e, 1,4,7, in one suit; 2,5,8 in another suit and the third suit being 3,6,9.
To achieve the hand using the principle from the illustration would make it at least a Limit Hand but creating it where the mixed Chows can have suits ordered in any way is much, much easier certainly less than a typical Half Limit hand.
So far, all descriptions I’ve come across on the Internet simply describe the hand as four mixed Chows and a mixed Pair and without providing an illustration.
Are you familiar with this hand pattern and if so have you any thoughts on how it ought to be created a) a with a strict pattern of suit e.g. 1,4.7 with one suit etc. or b) any pattern of suits being feasible.
I’ll await a reply before any further questions relating to the Moon-Well hand.
Kind regards,
Mal J

囧 Hi, Mal!
I agree that the book ought to clarify this. I checked T&M's other books, and I also checked Evans & Strauser (the edition I added new material to) and Max Robertson, and didn't find Crazy Chows in any of them. I could have checked even more works on Western mah-jongg, I suppose. Another author might include it.
I agree that it looks like the intent is that the suit order be maintained across all four mixed chows. I think it's best to go with that assumption.
And yes, you are correct that it would be quite possible to have a CMCR Knitted Straight in a Crazy Chows hand. But of course you can't claim points from another variant. (^_^)
I'm not sure I follow you where you wrote: "To achieve the hand using the principle from the illustration would make it at least a Limit Hand..." Are you saying that since the illustration shows a strict suit order, that its difficulty is equivalent to most Limit Hands? Whereas a looser interpretation of crazily-mixed chows (no suit-order requirement) seems more commensurate with Half Limit? It's not an unreasonable thought. If you want, your group can set that as a table rule.
When you want to go on to the next question, it would be great if you could give me the page number of the hand in the Companion book. Somebody must have asked me about Crazy Chows before - I already had a Post-It bookmark on that page!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 18, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Is this an American set?

On Friday, August 16, 2024 at 04:36:14 PM EDT, Rhonda B wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Oh please help me, I’m very new. I just purchased my 1st mah Jongg set came with 166 tiles (see photo)
I have NESW tiles
I don’t have 4 season tiles
I do have 16 flower tiles, all same exact flowers with no numbers
Do I have American mah Jongg set?
What very beginner book/chart should I look for?
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Rhonda!
Yes, it's an American set, since it has at least 8 flowers and it has at least 8 jokers. You should leave out 8 of the flowers and 2 of the jokers (and don't use the blanks), leaving in 8 flowers and 8 jokers. That leaves you the full 152-tile American set.
You can also use it to play most Asian variants, but since the flowers are all identical, the flowers can't be used the way Asian variants use flowers.
There are several books that describe American mah-jongg. See FAQ 3 for a list. Some new books have come out recently and I need to add some, but that will get you started. There are also several websites that describe the American rules. There are also friendly groups on facebook where you can ask people questions.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 16, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Is there really a "pay for the party" rule for throwing a player's obvious mahj tile?

On Thursday, August 15, 2024 at 07:35:40 PM EDT, Star F wrote:
Subject: Re: Question for MJ
Hi Tom,
We were discussing a rule I have never heard of. I was told that if you're playing and it's very obvious that Player #1 is waiting for 1 specific tile in order to call Mah Jongg. Even though we all know which tile she needs, Player #2 has no choice but to discard the winning tile and Player #1 calls it for Mah Jongg. Player #3 told us about a rule that if Player #2 discards the winning tile, knowing Mah Jongg would be called, she has to pay for all of us. She said that she should have thrown a tile she needed, rather than give Player #1 the tile she knew she needed for MJ. I have never heard of that rule, and can't find it. Can you please help me with this?
Thank you
Star

Hi, Star!
That's a tournament rule, not an official NMJL rule. If it was an official rule, it would be mentioned on the back of the card or in MJME or in a past annual newsletter ... and I promise you it's not there. See FAQ 19-CR for the situations that actually do invoke the "pay for the party" penalty.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 15, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Flicked tiles give me a headache, part 2

On Wednesday, August 14, 2024 at 11:27:46 PM EDT, Margo wrote:
Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Hello
Thank you very much for your extensive reply to my quandary.
I liked your man answer!
Way to take action.
Your advice was refreshingly different. Loved it.
Thank you!
Empowered Mahjoung woman
Sent from my iPhone

You're welcome, Margo!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 15, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Flicked tiles give me a headache

On Tuesday, August 13, 2024 at 12:37:57 AM EDT, Margo wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Hello, I am a normally fun loving experienced non tournament player.
I have been noticing a habit of some people at the table and it’s beginning to bother me:
Some players when they discard their tile , they flick it across the table.
I like to confirm visually the tile that they just called, but it gives me a headache watching their tile zip across the table.
Am I being too picky to be bothered by this?
What and how should I make my request ?
75 year old Virgo player
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Margo!
It's good that you are being observant of each discard. It's a habit I try to teach my students. Perhaps you are being too picky, but if you are actually getting headaches from watching quickly-moving tiles, I have some thoughts.
● You could gently say to the flicker, "I get headaches trying to follow moving objects, so could you please just place the tile?" And say the exact same thing each time they flick. Then ask the game's host for a headache pill.
● You could anticipate that a repeat flicker is going to flick, so unfocus your eyes or look at your opposite player's rack, then move your eyes to where the discard came to rest, and find the discard that matches the tile name the discarder said.
● You could close your eyes when the repeat flicker is going to flick, then ask the discarder to show you where their discard came to rest, explaining that to avoid a headache, you didn't try to follow its movement.
● You could talk to the group, request others' opinions, explaining your objection, and ask for a "no flicking" table rule.
● When the group pooh-poohs your objection, you could play the flicking game yourself, flicking the discard so hard it smacks loudly against whatever it hits. Maybe make the flicked tile overturn another discard, or even disturb a wall. That'll get the group's attention - they won't want you to flick tiles anymore, and when they forbid you from flicking tiles, the miscreant flicker will also be forbidden from flicking tiles. I admit that sounds a little juvenile and peevish, but it would probably be effective.
It's certainly possible that following rapidly moving objects gives you headaches - when I was a kid, I was a voracious reader and used to try to read every sign while riding in the back seat of my father's car, and would get carsick, so I get it. But it's also possible that you get a little mad when somebody flicks a tile, and so the headache is caused by rising blood pressure or adrenaline. Next time you visit an optometrist, you can ask for their advice about the headaches. They may have more tricks than what I've suggested.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 13, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

A discard was misnamed

On Sunday, August 11, 2024 at 02:40:49 PM EDT, storycookfav wrote:
Subject: question
Hi Mr Sloper
Recently had a group of people playing round robin Mahj. No scoring other than door prizes. It was a charity event. Some tables used traditional white mahj tiles and some used the colorful tiles with nontradional suit designs. There were players who had never seen these newer sets. I am not sure if that really factored into this issue, but it was mentioned. Here is the scene.
Game: Player 1 discarded a 5 bam but said 5 crack.
Player 3 says that's not a crack it's a bam,
while she is making statement, player 2 picks and racks.
Player 1 correctly names discard saying 5 bam.
Player 3 says I want that.
Player 2 says too late.
Player 1 is cussing about the strange tiles.
Player 3 still wants 5 bam
I was not at this table but was asked for an opinion. My thought was player 2 should not have picked if the tile was misnamed and someone questioned it.
In FAQ19 AY#3 says it is too late if mistake is noticed after next tile is racked.
Does the fact that Player 3's questioned the discard name prior to the pick/rack make any difference?
What would you do?
Thanks once again!

Hi, Story! I'm with you on this.
When a discard is misnamed, it is not available for calling until it's correctly named. MJME2023, page 16, rule 3.
When player 3 said "that's not a crak," it became public knowledge that the discard had been misnamed.
The game was on hold at that point, until the discarder said the correct name.
That means it was not yet player 2's turn.
That means player 2 picked out of turn.
If I was a judge and was called over to the table, and player 2 is holding a tile picked out of turn, I would either call player 2 dead or tell them to put the picked tile back on the wall. Either way, the discarder must then correctly name the tile and it's available for calling.
FAQ 19AY.3 doesn't apply because player 3 immediately made it known to all that the discard had been misnamed.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 11, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

About that fourth red five...

On Friday, August 9, 2024 at 06:14:37 PM EDT, Jason Y wrote:
Subject: Riichi Mahjogn question?
Hi Tom!
It’s said you are the authority on mahjong in the English speaking world so I have a question for you. Japanese riichi sets come with 4 red 5’s but usually play with 3. It’s said that some parlors or house rules will use all 4 red 5’s? Is this true? And if so, what rule typical rule set do they use?
Thanks!
Jason

Hi, Jason! I doubt there are many parlors or houses that use all four. I believe that the main reason for manufacturers providing a second red five is to fill the space that would otherwise exist in the 36-tile tray. If there has to be an extra of something, it might as well be an extra of the other tiles in the vertical row.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 9, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Valuation checklist, part 2

On Wednesday, August 7, 2024 at 11:00:13 AM EDT, Sarah N wrote:
MJ set value
Tom,
Thank you for the information, it was very helpful. I apologize for missing information, it seems that my cut and paste did not work out. Here is the rest of the checklist (and correction for #7) and some additional photos.
7. There are no sticks or chips or anything else aside from tiles, racks and dice. There are 2 dice which are white and black. There are 5 racks in good condition.
8. The container is wood with one tray. Pic attached.
9. The container is in good condition. Its a bot worn but closes properly. Latches work and look original. See pic.
10. There are 2 rule books in excellent condition (pic attached).
11. I think the cracks are older (pic attached).
12. One Bams pic attached.
13. Dragons pic attached.
14. Pics attached flowers.
15. Two jokers.
Thanks again. I appreciate your help.
Sent from my iPhone

Hi again, Sarah.
These new photos (less sharp due to smaller size) do not change the valuation range I gave you yesterday.
The two National Mah Jongg League cards are worth something to collectors, and can be sold separately from the set.
As I said yesterday, the latches or clasps are not original. I can see in a photo that there is an impression of the original latch/lock on the case's faux alligator-skin covering. Also see how they are relatively shiny, compared to the metal handle attachments, which are riveted on, not screwed on.
Yes, your "mystery tiles" are white dragons. If you're actually interested in knowing more about them, or any other tiles in the set, see the Mystery Tiles FAQ.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 7, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Valuation checklist

Subject: Valuation checklist
From: Sarah N
Tue, Aug 6 at 7:20 PM
Hello,
1. I have a Mah- Jong set of tiles, dice and racks that belonged to my aunt; I believe it to be enrobed bakelite or enrobed catalin. The enrobed area is brown.
2. Very good condition. Does not smell. I know very little about the game so there are 2 tiles that are questionable. I don’t know if they are supposed to have what appears to be red marker all over them and I will enclose a picture. The case is old but not too bad and the handle snd closure hardware work.
3. I believe they are enrobed Bakelite or enrobed catalin.
4. I don’t know much about it other than it belonged to my aunt. When she passed, she gave it to my mother, and my mother believes she probably got this in the 50s or 60s.
5. The tile size is 1 in and 3 cm by 2.5 cm.
6. 148 tiles (plus 4 extras). There are 10 flowers and two jokers. There are four tiles included in the 148 that I have not figured out where they belong.
7. 4 extras appear to be from a different set. I could use your help on that.
Thank you,
Sarah
Sent from my iPhone

I have not seen any recent sales prices on enrobed sets, but I'm confident that if your set had 152 enrobed tiles in Very Good condition, with 4 (or 5) racks in Very Good condition, with 2 (or more) dice and original Very Good chips, in a Very Good case, that it would go for many hundreds of dollars. But with all the flaws I can see (and can't see), I have to guess that you could maybe get a few hundred dollars for it. I know that's vague, but it's the best I can do. The mah jongg collectors group on Facebook would know better (but they, too, would need better pictures and a better description).
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 6, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

The 2024 NMJL card, part 11 (continued)

On Thursday, August 1, 2024 at 05:21:19 PM EDT, Cecile O wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Thanks for the info and it now makes perfectly good sense. Duh!
And I love your sometimes snarkyness!
Fellow New Yorker and FLX mahjong player
Cecile
Sent from my iPad

(^_^) Glad I could be of help, Cecile!
May the tiles be with you.

P.S. I just learned a useful Upstate acronym!

The 2024 NMJL card, part 11

On Thursday, August 1, 2024 at 01:34:22 PM EDT, Cecile O wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
I’m struggling with understanding #2 under 369. Can you explain what “like lungs 3, or 9 means?
Cecile
Sent from my iPad

On Thursday, August 1, 2024 at 01:35:42 PM EDT, Cecile O wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Sorry, pungs 3, 6, or 9
Sent from my iPad

Hi, Cecile!
Of course you already know that a "pung" is three identical tiles, like 333 or 666 or 999. "Like" means "alike." So you'll have a pair of flowers, then 3 66 999 in one suit, and then "like pungs" of either threes, or sixes, or nines in the other two suits. Because they have to be "alike," that means you can't mix and match - both your pungs must be threes, or they both must be sixes, or they both must be nines.
I'll add this to FAQ 16. If you come across any other questions about the NMJL card, you might find your question has already been answered there.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
August 1, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Can the quints hand ever be pure?

On Wednesday, July 31, 2024 at 07:58:13 PM EDT, Karin M wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Can the quints hand ever be pure even though you have to have jokers?  You can legitimately have the 4 pure tiles and then the joker.
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Karin!
I believe you're asking FAQ 19-DP, "Can I score for the jokerless bonus if I have only one joker in a quint?" As you'll see when you click that link, the answer is no. The jokerless bonus applies only to hands that contain no jokers and are not listed in the Singles & Pairs section. You already get a "bonus" for a quint hand, because the Quints hands are already valued higher than regular hands.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 31, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Have you seen flag flowers before?

On Monday, July 29, 2024 at 11:27:30 PM EDT, Katie M wrote:
Subject: Interesting flower/season tiles
Good evening!
I have devoured your FAQ for all the info I can glean about the mahjong set I found in my grandpa’s basement. I have learned that is a Chinese classic on bone and bamboo from the early 1920s. I have searched the internet for another example of my flower/season tiles, but no such luck. Even google image search for these tiles turns up nothing. I was able to find a set with the same box, but their flower/season tiles were different. Have you seen tiles with flags before?
Thank you!
Katie

Hi, Katie! I haven't seen an exact match to your flowers, but there is a flag flower in the Mystery Flowers FAQ (search the page for "countries"),

and I have a commemorative set from a 2005 international mah-jongg tournament that includes a flag flower.

So yes, I've seen a couple of flag flowers before, but no, I don't recall seeing a set of four flag flowers like yours before. Handmade flower tiles (like 1920s bone/bamboo tiles) are often unique. That's one thing that intrigues collectors. Also, I think your set could be from the mid-to-late 1920s.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 2, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I touched a tile

On Thursday, July 25, 2024 at 09:56:38 AM EDT, Mary Lou F wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: I touched a tile when it was not my turn. The player had picked and then dropped the tile. I attempted to place it at another place on the wall but the player wanted the tile. The tile was given back the player. I know I was wrong but the player was very angry because I had touched her tile.
Thanks, Mary Lou F

Hi, Mary Lou! You wrote:

MLF: I touched a tile when it was not my turn. The player had picked and then dropped the tile. I attempted to place it at another place on the wall
TS: What? That's illegal. A dropped tile goes back on the wall exactly where it came from (see FAQ 19-BX). But it wasn't your job to do that.

MLF: the player wanted the tile. The tile was given back the player. I know I was wrong but the player was very angry because I had touched her tile.
TS: You didn't just touch it, you were taking her tile away from her. Anyway, that's an interesting story. You know you were wrong, you say. If there was a question behind this story, I hope I answered it.

May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 25, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Tom do you have any articles or written instruction on playing Filipino Mahjong on your website?

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Barbara W R 4d
Sat 4:05?PM
Tom do you have any articles or written instruction on playing Filipino Mahjong on your website? I looked but there’s only about a gazillion articles and I couldn’t see a search ?? feature.
If you reply, Barbara W R will also be able to call you and see info like your Active Status and when you've read messages.
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Hi, Barbara!
There is a search feature: Google.
A Google search for "filipino mahjong sloperama" turns up these mentions of Filipino mah-jongg on my site,with these four right at the top of the search results:
https://www.sloperama.com/mjfaq/mjfaq11b.html
https://sloperama.com/mjfaq/tree.htm
https://www.sloperama.com/mjfaq/mjfaq01.html
https://www.sloperama.com/mjfaq/mjfaq02b.html
Those first two are brief mentions, the third one has a little more info, but that fourth one contains all the information I have on my site about how to play Filipino mah-jongg.
The search feature works! (^_^)
囧 I'm sorry that it took me 4 days to find your message, but I don't use Facebook as my main communication method with the world. I'm old-fashioned, and I'm not going to change: email is my main communication method. When I first joined Facebook in 2007, I friended just about everyone who requested a friend connection. As a result, I have hundreds of Facebook friends (Facebook won't tell me how many exactly, no matter how hard I try*), and I don't actually know 25% of them. So I don't accept any new friend requests or message requests from people I don't know. Long story short: I'm sorry that I will not reply on Facebook. I hope this long explanation clarifies why. I hope you come here and find this reply.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 25, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

* Found it. 484 friends (right at the top, under my name and next to my profile picture. Duh! - Tom

What are these mystery tiles?

On Wednesday, July 24, 2024 at 05:00:38 PM EDT, Kaia L wrote:
Subject: Q&A Question/Set Identification
Hello,
Thank you so much for providing this Q&A Bulletin Board service. I was hoping that you might be able to identify this set that I purchased for playing Filipino Mahjong. I believe that it is the full set, as it fills the fabric covered cardboard box it was stored in pretty perfectly, but I noticed it includes none of the conventional seasons or flowers.
I was able to identify 4 of the tiles typically used in Singapore Mahjong, but the inclusion of the 4 ladies and lack of seasons/flowers perplexes me. Are there other variants that I would be able to play with this set?
Thank you very much for reading this email,
Kaia L

Together with your suits, winds, and dragons, you have 8 flowers, 4 jokers, and 4 blank tiles, for a total of 152 tiles. You can play any variant except Japanese or Vietnamese. If your 4 jokers and 4 blanks were stickered into American-style jokers, you'd have a set capable of playing American mah-jongg. Of course Filipino mah-jongg can be played with the set, no problem.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 24, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

What is the rationale, part 2

On Wednesday, July 24, 2024 at 11:00:35 AM EDT, Marilyn P wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Thank you for answering and posting. Apparently my original email question (July 23) was not clear regarding noticing, mid-game, a player had three too many tiles. We had 4 players. Everyone had the proper number of tiles when we started the game. Somehow, a player picked up some extra tiles, maybe when pushing out a wall. Maybe some tiles fell when pushing out a wall, which she attempted to straighten without noticing she had mistakenly placed some on her rack….we have no idea.
However, we thought it made more sense to: completely stop the game, everyone throw in their tiles, and start a new game made rather than simply calling the erring player’s hand dead with the three of us finishing the game. We felt this way because, her hand contained jokers, and as the error was caught before she exposed anything, we remaining three players lost the possibility of exchanging for any of her jokers.
Wasn’t the end of the world. Timing and luck.

Okay, Marilyn. My guess about it being a 3-player game was incorrect.
I fully understood your reasoning for stopping the game rather than calling the player's hand dead. But my previous counterargument missed the overall point (you weren't continuing to play). In your group's thinking, then, the game was effectively ruined. I don't agree, but your group can do whatever you want.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 2, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

What is the rationale behind this rule?

On Tuesday, July 23, 2024 at 05:11:27 PM EDT, Marilyn P wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Three of us started the game with 13 tiles and one with 14 tiles. It was noticed midway during the game that one player had 16 tiles. Her hand was called dead and 3 of us continued to the end. Still, we felt the tiles should have been thrown in and the game ended immediately because the erring player (1) had such an advantage at the beginning; and, (2) had the game progressed, some of her jokers may have been exposed, becoming available for exchange by other players. Why do the NMJL rules favor calling a hand dead rather than throwing in all tiles and starting over?

Hi, Marilyn! I was not present at the NMJL rules committee's discussion when that rule was created, so I cannot tell you the reasoning behind their decision for that rule. Actually, that rule probably goes all the way back to the original Chinese rules.

(1) You seem to be assuming that the player's extra 3 tiles were the result of some sort of Charleston error. So if it was a 3-player game, you must be using your own custom 3-player Charleston table rule. I suppose the error could have happened then, but that isn't necessarily the only possible way to wind up with too many tiles.

(2) Yes, I suppose it could be possible she could have been holding a handful of jokers. But is that really a good reason for allowing an obviously dead player to continue playing? Because she might have a whole bunch of jokers that she might expose, so others might be able to redeem? Couldn't such reasoning then be extended to any dead player for any reason? They have to keep playing without a chance of winning just because they might expose some jokers? That's an untenable rule. If I knew I was dead, I certainly wouldn't call any discards and expose any jokers, because what I would want is a wall game. That way I wouldn't have to pay a winner. I would discard prudently and not make any exposures at all, once I knew I was dead. I certainly wouldn't knowingly expose my jokers for the possible benefit of my opponents!

Although I can't justify the existence of each and every rule, it seems to me that the rule that says "a player who is holding too many tiles (especially three too many) is dead" is not an unreasonable rule.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 24, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Any like numbers #3 defense, complicated by blanks

On Monday, July 22, 2024 at 09:20:16 PM EDT, Rebecca M wrote:
Subject: Any like numbers #3 defense
Hi!
I’m running into trouble with any like numbers #3 defense. This is the favorite hand in our group due to playing with blanks. I’ve started just keeping all winds unless I’m forced to pass and trying quint #2 or 2024 hands concealed hands or winds each time I have winds in the Charleston. Any ideas besides stopping blanks (I’m trying!)?
Rebecca

囧 Gosh, Rebecca, I only know the official NMJL rules. "Blanks" are a viral new feature some players use. There are no official "blanks" rules, so every table probably has their own table rule for how blanks are to be used. For me to be able to advise you on your strategy, you'd have to explain all your "blanks" rules to me. Also, I don't know what "stopping blanks" means! Does it mean NOT using a blanks rule at all, or some sort of play where a player can stop someone's use of a blank? Also, is your problem defending when you're making Any Like #3? (That would actually not be defense but rather offense.) Or when an opponent is making it? (That would be defense.)
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 22, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I noticed I have too many tiles, part 2

On Sunday, July 21, 2024 at 07:30:05 PM EDT, Jody P wrote:
Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Thanks for the quick response. I had a great hand when this happened. We were playing Chinese mah Jong. I had red dragon kongs and wind of the round kongs and all one suit for three doubles if I could have called mah Jong. But, I called my hand dead in all the excitement so I didn’t finish playing let alone call MJ. That’s painful.
My fellow players said I should have just quietly discarded the extra tile but I knew that didn’t sound right. Thanks!
Sent from my iPhone

Heh. That would be cheating, technically. And since you're playing Chinese rather than American, the proper expression when kvetching is ayah! rather than oy vey!
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 21, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

I noticed I have too many tiles

On Sunday, July 21, 2024 at 05:34:51 PM EDT, Jody P wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: I noticed I have too many tiles but no one has called my hand dead. I know I shouldn’t call my own hand dead so can I discard two tiles at my next turn to make the number correct?

No, Jody, you can't do that. You should resign yourself to not winning this hand, without letting your body language or expressions give anything away to the other players. Play cagey, and try not to discard anyone's hot tiles. Hope for a wall game. When the post-game kvetching begins, you can join in, "I had too many tiles but none of you called me dead, so..." then sigh for effect while gesturing with your palms up. That's some good post-game kvetching.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 21, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Is racking a tile required?

On Wednesday, July 17, 2024 at 10:49:30 AM EDT, Christopher D <marilynd... wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: in 2024 rules is racking a tile required?
D

Hi, Marilyn!
No. It isn't required. See FAQ 19-BL.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 17, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Two players went dead with erroneous mahj in a three-player game, part 2

On Wednesday, July 17, 2024 at 12:46:33 AM EDT, Debbie Barnett wrote:
Subject: Mah Jongg in Error
Hello Tom, hope you are well and enjoying life! I was reading the question from Ruth S. and your response and would like you to take a second look please. The back of the card, #3 states, if there are 3 dead hands that do not result in MJ in Error, the surviving player throws in their hand and no one gets paid. But as we know the back of the card is so limited in spacing for any sort of detail.
The scenario Ruth gave states 2 players had Mah Jongg in Error so I think that the 2nd erring player pays the last standing player double the value of the hand the remaining player was attempting to make. MJME, page 22, 5(b) 
I made this nifty chart that I include in my Mahjpedia App to help with these scenarios as they do get confusing. 

Mah Jongg in Error and Dead Hand Scenarios:
[Table omitted]

Let me know after you revisit the question. Thanks always for your valued feedback! 
Kind Regards,
Debbie Barnett

Hi, Debbie!
Your table/chart was much too much work to try to convert to HTML; after spinning wheels trying (at least 20 minutes, maybe half an hour), I simply gave it up. Way too much work, and I have a lot going on today. You're saying that your scenario 3 applies to Ruth's situation.
Scenario 3
Player A declares Mah Jongg in error.
Player B throws in hand or declares Mah Jongg in error.
C and D continue to play.
Player C's hand goes dead.
I agree that this matches Ruth's situation better than your scenario 6, which is what I applied to Ruth's situation yesterday.
Scenario 6
3 Dead hands that did not result from any Mah Jongg.
So yes, I doff my hat to you, o Mahjongg Teacher. The penalty, per MJME2023 p.22, 5(b), is: the second erroneous declarer pays double the value of the hand she was trying to make to the surviving player. I'll let Ruth know.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 17, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

How do we reconcile our rules, part 2

On Tuesday, July 16, 2024 at 09:01:09 PM EDT, Ilene F wrote:
Subject: Re: Table Rule question
TY

YW!

How do we reconcile our rules?

On Tuesday, July 16, 2024 at 08:23:32 PM EDT, Ilene F wrote:
Subject: Table Rule question
I am looking for your opinion on a scenario that happened today. We play NMJL Rules but also have a table rule about throwing to a third exposure. If you decide to chance it and the player Mahj’s, you pay of 4th table. BUT, what if the player who threw the tile is PIE.I have always played (even thought the scenario is rare) that the person must go in their actual purse to pay. Why should the player lose out from any payment for their win? What is your thoughts. Thank you in advance.
~ilene

Hi, ilene!
If you have a pay-for-the-party rule and a pie rule, and somebody goes pie, that player can throw caution to the wind and throw winning tiles willy-nilly without having to pay. If you make that player pay more than pie, doesn't that invalidate the entire concept of pie altogether? I don't think these are compatible rules. If you have a pie rule, there shouldn't be any requirement for a player to pay more than what's in the pie, in any circumstance. If you have a pay-for-the-party rule, then there shouldn't be a pie rule.
Those are my thoughts. But your group should figure this out for itself. Reconciling your group's rules is your group's responsibility; all players must agree - see the Table Rules Rules.
May the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 17, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Two players went dead with erroneous mahj in a three-player game...

On Tuesday, July 16, 2024 at 02:10:02 AM EDT, Ruth S wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
Sent from my iPhone. There were three of us playing. Player number one called Mahjong and exposed hand and realized it was closed hand and said she was dead. Other two players continued then second player called Mahjong and exposed and one player said it’s a closed hand and she was dead. My question is what happens with other player. Does she get paid as she was still alive in the game? Thanking you in advance for your assistance.

Hi, Ruth! I'm afraid I need more information.

RS: Player number one called Mahjong and exposed hand and realized it was closed hand...
TS: Did she have one or more exposures atop her rack before calling mahj and exposing the rest of her tiles? That information was not part of what you've told me.

RS: and said she was dead.
TS: One is not supposed to call one's own hand dead.

RS: ... second player called Mahjong and exposed and one player said it’s a closed hand and she was dead.
TS: Did she have one or more exposures atop her rack before calling mahj and exposing the rest of her tiles? That information was not part of what you've told me. A player must reveal their tiles in order to claim a win. The Concealed/Exposed aspect of a hand depends on prior exposures.

RS: ...what happens with other player. Does she get paid...
TS: The rule about two players going dead in a three-player game is covered by the rule about three players going dead in a four-player game. See FAQ 19-BW. Your two players went dead by their own errors, and nobody compounded the errors by ruining the game (throwing in their tiles or destroying the wall), so the surviving player is not owed anything. The game is simply over. The dice move to the next East to start the next game.
The rule is stated on the back of the card ("Mah Jongg in Error" rule #3) but I think it's stated confusingly. Two players declared mahj in error, not resulting in cascading errors. The surviving player gets paid only if another player compounds an erroneous mahj by throwing in their own hand or destroying the remaining wall.

Play safe out there. And may the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 16, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"

Are players required to expose their hand after a game?

On Sunday, July 14, 2024 at 06:14:14 PM EDT, Linda P wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: Are players required to expose their hand after someone declares Mahjongg? I usually play on-line and sometimes I expose my hand at the end but sometimes I forget to do so and move on to the next game. - is it a personal choice to expose hand ? Thank you
Sent from my iPad

Hi, Linda! No, there's no official rule saying one must share in the post-game kvetch session that often follows a game. That's what I call it, anyway: good old-fashioned complaining. Some people like to share their sad struggle and point fingers at those holding "their" tile(s). Some people ask others, "who had my 5-craks?" I might show and tell when I'd been in an ironic or unusual situation, and I'll respond if someone asks me if I had "their" tile(s). On the other hand, a lot of the time, players will just throw in their tiles without comment (perhaps keeping their strategies to themselves). If you find yourself at a table where everyone else always shows their tiles, I suppose they might see you as not a fun player, if you don't show yours too. But there's no rule.
Play safe out there. And may the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 14, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"
Donations appreciated

Is it like checkers? Can they pick it back up?

On Wednesday, July 10, 2024 at 08:01:45 PM EDT, Patricia P wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: A player places a discard on the table and calls it, but doesn’t take their hand off of the tile. Can they then pick it back up? Someone asked me that today and I assumed it was like checkers and they could pick it back up. I was told it was not checkers and they wanted to know the rule. Thank you.
Sent from my iPad

On Wednesday, July 10, 2024 at 08:02:23 PM EDT, service@paypal wrote:
Subject: Reference: MJ@Sloperama Sloperama Mah-Jongg Answers - Donation from Patricia P
Hello Thomas Sloper,
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Thank you for the donation, Patricia!
A discard is "DOWN" when it either touches the table or is completely named (whichever occurs first). I've played with people who keep their hand on the discard after placing it and/or naming it; I always tell them, "you might as well let go of it, because it's down now and you can't take it back." Meanwhile they're holding up the game by keeping their hand in the middle of the table. If they don't let go, I say, "please let go. It's down." See FAQs 19a and 19b.
TBH, I don't know if backsies is part of checkers rules or not.
Play safe out there. And may the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 10, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"
Donations appreciated

Can she pung and meld a kong on the same turn, part 3

On Friday, July 5, 2024 at 10:21:28 PM EDT, Stan H wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q+A
Hi Tom. Thanks for responding to my question. I do know know how to determine variant I’m playing. Can you help define?
What happened today was my sister pong the 3 round tile that was discarded. She then proceeded to play take a 2 round tile from within her hand to add to a set of 2 rounds that was exposed from an earlier pong—and drew an extra tile from the wall. I explained that this was two distinct actions that would not be allowed. She should revealed her fourth 2 round for gong when it was her turn to draw from the wall. Is this correct? Thanks again and I would be happy to determine variant that we play. Stan
Sent from my iPhone

Yes, Stan. You told your sister what I told you. Millington says a player may not pung and kong in the same turn.
I wrote FAQ 2 to help people identify what kind of mah-jongg they play. See FAQ 2b. It asks a few questions to help determine your variant. Then if that doesn't help, FAQ 2c describes the known variants. You ought to be able to get some clues there. Also, do you use a book, and if so, what is its title and who is the author?
Play safe out there. And may the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 6, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"
Donations appreciated

Can I pung and meld a kong on the same turn, part 2

On Friday, July 5, 2024 at 08:20:30 PM EDT, Stan H wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jong question or comment is: clarification of previous question—can you pong to make a set of “three rounds” and in the same turn place a fourth “2 rounds” to a set of 2 rounds from an earlier pong to then draw extra tile from wall?
Sent from my iPhone

I see, Stan. You're not asking about melding a concealed kong but rather promoting a pung to a kong. Let's walk it through:
1. You start your turn by calling a discard to expose a pung.
2. Now you want to promote another exposed pung to a kong. Let's see FAQ 20d again: "When you have an exposed pung and you pick the fourth tile from the wall, you have the option of promoting your exposed pung to an exposed kong." But that's not what you're doing (you haven't picked; you called a discard). What must have happened is that you either had that fourth tile already in your hand and only exposed a pung at first, or you obtained that fourth tile after making the pung but didn't add it to the exposure at that time.
I had to check A. D. Millington's definitive work, "The Complete Book of Mah-Jongg." His book documents the classical Chinese rules from which other variants have descended. So this rule, Rule 51 on page 38, probably also applies in your variant (I'd still love to know which variant you play).
The answer to your question is:
No, you are not allowed to promote a pung after first exposing a pung. You will have to wait and do it after beginning your turn by picking from the wall. That is permitted. I suppose I should modify FAQ 20d!
Play safe out there. And may the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 5, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"
Donations appreciated

How can I find out how old it is? (Part 3)

On Friday, July 5, 2024 at 07:39:55 PM EDT, Elizabeth Abram wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q A
Can we connect on WhatsApp?
Kindest regards
Liz

Sorry, Liz. I do email and worldwide web only. That's a requirement for the mah-jongg information I give here. If you can't see the checklist in FAQ 7g and/or otherwise can't send me the checklist and photos by email, then I can't help you. You might try asking around in some mah-jongg groups on Facebook.
Good luck!
Tom

Can I pung and meld a kong on the same turn?

On Friday, July 5, 2024 at 06:50:48 PM EDT, Stan H wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: if a player pong ( make triplet) then reveal a Kong (quads) in same turn before discarding, is that player allowed to draw extra card from wall?
Sent from my iPhone

On Friday, July 5, 2024 at 06:53:35 PM EDT, Stan H wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: is a player allowed to pong and reveal Kong in same turn; and receive extra card from wall
Sent from my iPhone

On Friday, July 5, 2024 at 07:03:42 PM EDT, Stan H wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q+A
My mah-jongg question or comment is: can inside quads be revealed anytime even if out of turn?
Sent from my iPhone

Hi, Stan! Sounds like you play an Asian or British/Australian variant, in which kongs are regarded as "glorified pungs" thus net the player an extra tile.
As explained in FAQ 20d, you can meld (lay down) an entirely concealed kong and then take a replacement tile. The only reason to meld a Concealed Kong is to get the replacement tile (because without doing so, the tile count of the hand is messed up and you can't declare mah-jongg).
The only time you can meld a Concealed Kong is during your turn. There are two ways to start your turn: by picking from the wall or by calling a discarded tile. So, yes, you can claim a discard for pung and then meld a Concealed Kong and take a replacement tile before discarding (all in the same turn). Just curious: do you know which variant you play? Chinese Official? Hong Kong? Japanese riichi? British/Australian? Wright-Patterson? (There are many more.)
Play safe out there. And may the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 5, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"
Donations appreciated

How can I find out how old it is? (Part 2)

On Friday, July 5, 2024 at 06:25:01 PM EDT, Elizabeth A wrote:
Subject: Re: Mah-Jongg Q A
I am confused, what should i send you? There is no inscriptions on this, no details of anything. Sending paypal contribution thank you.
Kindest regards
Liz

Liz, the the 'How Old Is It?' FAQ Set-Age Determination List asks things like:
1. Write a factual detailed list of all the contents of your set. Describe all the contents, listing all dice, chips, racks, etc. If you do not know what to call the pieces, see our FAQ 7d. (That's a clickable link in the FAQ.)
2. If the set contains any paper materials, like an instruction booklet or scoring card, write the title, author's name (if any), and date (if any) of those materials.
3. What are the tiles made of? (See our FAQ 7c.)
4. Describe what you know about when the set was made or purchased, if you know. Describe the history of the set to the best of your knowledge. See our FAQ 11 before you make any unsupportable claims (such as "this set is over a hundred years old!" or "this set is from the Qing Dynasty!"); the knowledgeable collectors can see through claims that are ignorant of the actual history of the game.
5. What are the dimensions of the tiles? Use either inches or metric (one or the other, not both - doesn't matter which; just be precise). Height, width, depth. If the tiles are bone & bamboo, give thickness of the bone portion. (Same goes for ivory & bamboo tiles.)
6. How many tiles are there in the set? Your best bet is to lay out the tiles on a table in 4 rows of identical tiles (as is done in our FAQ 7a... And take a picture while you're at it. How many flowers, how many jokers, and are the basic 136 - suits, winds, dragons - all present?).
And the checklist goes on from there, talking about the photos I need, and so on.
It would be generous of you to send a donation, but why not wait until we see if I can help you or not.
Play safe out there. And may the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 5, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"
Donations appreciated

How can I find out how old it is?

On Friday, July 5, 2024 at 04:38:44 PM EDT, Elizabeth A wrote:
Subject: Mah-Jongg Q A
My mah-jongg question or comment is:
I have a set in a box with jaques on front. The instruction book talks about bamboo and ivory sticks. I cannot find any dates on case. This is untouched. How do i find out age etc?
Kindest regards
Liz

Hi, Liz! I can help you if you send me the information and pictures requested in the 'How Old Is It?' FAQ. The important part is the Set-Age Determination List. Send me the requested checklist, along with good pictures, and I'll go from there. (~_^)
Play safe out there. And may the tiles be with you.
Tom Sloper
Rochester, New York, USA
July 5, 2024
Author of "The Red Dragon & The West Wind"
Donations appreciated

I am in the market to purchase Pick Racks and through my search I came across your address.

On Monday, July 1, 2024 at 07:09:20 AM EDT, Daniel Forson <danielandsonscoltd@gmail.com> wrote:
To: Pick Racks Inquiry
Bcc:mj@sloperama
Greetings,
Hope you are fine. Well I am in the market to purchase Pick Racks and through my search I came across your address. Kindly let me know the models you have or a link to the ones you have in stock. Also want to know whether you consider credit card an option for payment? Write soon.
Best Regards,
Daniel Forson

Dear Daniel,
Thank you for your inquiry about our fine Pick Racks. We have a variety of types, for racking a wide assortment of picks, our most popular being Guitar, Ice, Tooth, Hand, Finger, Nose, Nut, and Nit. They come in attractive colors, too; just select using the color dropdown menu on the order page. In regards to your payment option query, we most certainly do accept most major credit cards, as well as Bitcoin, Ethereum, Doge, and other major cryptocurrencies. We also accept personal checks, traveler's checks, spotchecks, Monopoly money, Paypal, Venmo, Apple Pay, and most other payment apps. We have payment plans as well: you can gladly pay us Tuesday for a Pick Rack order today.
We look forward to receiving your order soon. Thank you for thinking of us for your Pick Rack needs.

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